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What I'd Like To See: Wounds & Healing

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  • Halvard
    started a topic What I'd Like To See: Wounds & Healing

    What I'd Like To See: Wounds & Healing

    So, I will importantly preface this by saying I have absolutely no knowledge or experience in coding a game. Therefore, I don’t expect any of these ideas to be easy or quick to implement, if they were implemented at all, and I totally understand that an actual person (or people) would have to take time to put it all together.

    With that said… here’s something that has been rattling around in my brain in regards to:

    Wounds & Healing

    So, this has been on my mind in some form for months now, and after Odjit’s recent posting I decided to actually organise some of these thoughts.

    Wounds serve a function in CM: to give a system ‘status’ to reflect a character’s IC damage, from a light bruise because you successfully found some furniture in the dark with your little toe to a grave wound because the piece of furniture you successfully found was an entire iron maiden in a pit of snakes. It is perfectly functional as it is, and I’m not suggesting it is bad. It is, however, limited, and requires increasing levels of creativity to accurately portray the more grievous the wound. Now, creativity is obviously not a bad thing, but sometimes the system just doesn’t like the way we want to express things, and the healing side of things feels very… simple. Not necessarily bad, but I would like to see something a little more complex and engaging. I have quite a few thoughts about the process of things, so I’ll try to lay this out in chronological order (from the point of wound to the end of the healing process).

    Stage One: Getting the Wound

    Currently, the actual thing that wounds you has no system effect on your wound (except that some coded things probably force a higher level of wound (that I know of)). This means that a grave wound from a warhammer is the same as a grave wound from burning, system-wise. This does have a benefit, in that the vagueness of the wound lets you do what you want with it from an RP perspective, but I find it a little underwhelming, and it can require constant OOC explaining about what the wound really is (not to mention OOC disagreements). So, with that in mind…
    • Wound Types: No more single flavour wounds. Now the wound would be specific to the type of damage that caused it. Some examples: Slashing Wound (eg. slashing bladed weapons or claws), Crushing Wound (eg. blunt weapons, falling rocks, Victor’s forehead), Piercing Wound (eg. arrows, stabbing implements, Boreas’ stare). These could likely function as a foundation for all wound types, upon which layers (and therefore complications for Healers and patients) can be added, such as: Infected Wound (eg. from poor treatment or simple misfortune, because let’s be realistic about the level of doctoring our Healers actually have), Poisoned Wound (speaks for itself), Magical Wound (anything that is both inflicted and progresses magically, so a simple burn from a spell wouldn’t really count because the burn itself is mundane, or at least mundanely treated).
    • Update the Implement: Probably more realistically, the @woundme system could be updated to have more qualifiers, so rather than just specifying where and how bad the wound is, you would add what type of wound, and any complication could be added then or later depending on circumstances and OOC communication with your Healer. However, ideally, I would like to see items that already cause system wounding to be given a specific type of wounding property (or properties) depending on what it is. Examples: Longsword (slashing wound, piercing wound), Warhammer (crushing wound), Rapier (piercing wound), Bow/Arrows (piercing wound) and so on. That would be standardised, but individual weapons and implements could also be given complication properties (so a poisoned longsword would have slashing wound/piercing wound AND poisoned wound, or a rusty as fudge dagger would having piercing wound and infected wound). For implements with more than one wound property, it would likely just randomize between the two when auto-wounding because it would probably be too difficult to match the wound type with the specific flavor text of whether it was a cut or a jab etc. And for improvised things (like falling debris, or items/situations that can’t actually be used, system-wise (like falling down stairs, or just RP fights), the updated @woundme system would cover it. So, you’re in MCombat and you get struck by someone with a rusty dagger, instead of the system just giving you a random severity wound, it would give you a random severity piercing wound, with a high chance of causing the infected wound complication. Or if that occasional attention-seeking Newly throws themselves into the Courtyard from the Art Gallery and lands on someone, you could use @woundme to give yourself an appropriately-severe crushing wound to your body.

  • Charmiam
    replied
    I do very much like the idea of healers making mistakes.

    Just to add an extra layer of complexity, what about the robustness of the wounded person? My character has had a serious wound that took only two days to completely heal due to the skill of the healer, yet a slight wound on the hand gave a fatigue handicap for a week. This doesn't seem right to me.

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  • Halvard
    replied
    Originally posted by Dolph View Post
    Part of the fun of healing for both patient and healer is the roleplay involved. The game doesn't need to tell me what we the players can create.
    I'm totally in agreement on this point. RP should really always be the first priority.

    As I imagine it, the system wouldn't dictate anything to us that wasn't already the obvious case, really. For instance, if you get given a wound by a weapon (or @woundme system that can specify the type of wound, not just the severity) that gives a slashing wound, the wound would show up as a slashing wound. That's not taking any agency away from the player to RP their wound accordingly, it just cuts down on the back-and-forth paging of asking what kind of wound the player is imagining they got from being hit really hard with a slashing weapon. It's just a more efficient way of understanding what we're seeing. At least, as I understand it.

    I feel it opens up more avenues for RP, however, than what it could possibly limit. Like I suggested, if a system could be coded for the possibility of mistakes being made, that is a whole scenario of RP and consequences. Can mistakes be made as it is? Sure, but only when both players agree and negotiate on how bad the mistake is, whether either of them noticed, what the consequences would be, whether staff are okay with it, whether it can be effectively RP'd to anyone not in the know, and so on - and that's only if both players are willing to risk death or lingering extended injury (on the patient's behalf) or disfavor and demotion (on the Healer's behalf), which, let's face it, has always been a problem. People aren't often compelled to risk their characters when they don't have to, or outside of an obviously dangerous plot. I suppose in this case you could consider my suggestion to be forcing that kind of situation upon players, which is true to a degree, but I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing in some instances. You (general you, not you specifically) probably shouldn't be making a quasi-medieval healer character if you're not cool about them ever possibly making a mistake, and you probably shouldn't be looking at a sword wound as nothing more than an enforced motel stay.

    As for the time it takes to heal wounds... I don't know, but I do think they should stay on the shorter side. But that's an issue for another thread. I don't really envision my suggestion having too much effect on the time it takes to heal. That's more of a scale thing that we just have to accept as fundamental to this being a game and not real life. I couldn't master a totally new language in six months, let alone a year or two, but we accept it as something our characters can do in-game because otherwise we're spending too long in the process of opening up new avenues of RP, and not enough in the actual RP itself.

    But like I said, this isn't a system that is being implemented, it's just something I'd like to see. I'm also a long-time D&D player (more of a DM, really), and I think that sometimes there's such a thing as too much freedom of imagination. Now and then I think we need a little more realism to keep things running coherently.

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  • Dolph
    replied
    As a player of a pretty prominent healer, I feel like I should chime in on some of this too - as I've thought in many ways that Healing as a whole COULD do with an upgrade. However, we need to bear in mind one VERY important thing.

    What is fun for the players, both the injured and the healer?

    Originally posted by Halvard View Post
    Wounds serve a function in CM: to give a system ‘status’ to reflect a character’s IC damage, from a light bruise because you successfully found some furniture in the dark with your little toe to a grave wound because the piece of furniture you successfully found was an entire iron maiden in a pit of snakes. It is perfectly functional as it is, and I’m not suggesting it is bad. It is, however, limited, and requires increasing levels of creativity to accurately portray the more grievous the wound. Now, creativity is obviously not a bad thing, but sometimes the system just doesn’t like the way we want to express things, and the healing side of things feels very… simple.
    You're not wrong. Healing is limited (We have four hitpoints, and there's no real "in between". As a result, we have to roleplay our wounds, something we've done for a very, very long time. Odjit put up a great post about wounds and proper roleplay to them, that I feel like should really be read by quota a few more people

    But how long does it take to heal each of those wounds? I'm glad you asked.

    Columns are Healer level, Wound type, time to treat patient, time to heal.
    Novice Light 10 minutes 10 days
    Novice Serious 20 minutes 20 days
    Novice Grave 30 minutes 30 days
    Apprentice Light 9 minutes 9 days
    Apprentice Serious 18 minutes 18 days
    Apprentice Grave 27 minutes 27 days
    Senior Apprentice Light 8 minutes 8 days
    Senior Apprentice Serious 16 minutes 16 days
    Senior Apprentice Grave 24 minutes 24 days
    Fellowcraft Light 7 minutes 7 days
    Fellowcraft Serious 14 minutes 14 days
    Fellowcraft Grave 21 minutes 21 days
    Journyman Light 6 minutes 6 days
    Journyman Serious 12 minutes 12 days
    Journyman Grave 18 minutes 18 days
    Artisan Light 5 minutes 5 days
    Artisan Serious 10 minutes 10 days
    Artisan Grave 15 minutes 15 days
    Senior Artisan Light 4 minutes 4 days
    Senior Artisan Serious 8 minutes 8 days
    Senior Artisan Grave 12 minutes 12 days
    Master Light 3 minutes 3 days
    Master Serious 6 minutes 6 days
    Master Grave 9 minutes 9 days
    Master Adept Light 2 minutes 2 days
    Master Adept Serious 4 minutes 4 days
    Master Adept Grave 6 minutes 6 days
    Grand Master Light 1 minute 1 day
    Grand Master Serious 2 minutes 2 days
    Grand Master Grave 3 minutes 3 days
    Hold up. Did you say "brink of death" in three days?

    Yep. GM Healer (Dolph's level) can take someone with a gash the size of Mississippi and, code wise, make them good as new before the week ends. Not even half a week.

    So yes - there's a bit of an unrealistic gap here. Modern medicine can't even do that.

    Possible solution: Change the code. Double the time for each particular wound size. Make a GM healer on a grave wound take 10 days instead.

    Does that work? Yeah, a little more realistically. And it's doable too. But now we get to the second part - Is it fun for the players?

    Do YOU, as a player, want to roleplay being stuck in a room nursing a wound at grave for 10 days? How about 7? even 2? I see people all the time saying "How long do I have to stay here. I can't do anything."

    Let's be blunt - Just like playing a criminal is no fun when you're stuck in jail for a year, getting hurt for a week or two is just as bad.

    "Oh, but maybe people can visit?" That'd be nice. It'd get some good RP from both Healer and Patient, but unfortunately, the vast majority of individuals that get injured are more happy with getting better so they can wander than sitting still. And I really can't blame them, because being couped up sucks, especially if you're only playing one character.

    So what's the solution?

    • Wound Types: No more single flavour wounds. Now the wound would be specific to the type of damage that caused it. Some examples: Slashing Wound (eg. slashing bladed weapons or claws), Crushing Wound (eg. blunt weapons, falling rocks, Victor’s forehead), Piercing Wound (eg. arrows, stabbing implements, Boreas’ stare). These could likely function as a foundation for all wound types, upon which layers (and therefore complications for Healers and patients) can be added, such as: Infected Wound (eg. from poor treatment or simple misfortune, because let’s be realistic about the level of doctoring our Healers actually have), Poisoned Wound (speaks for itself), Magical Wound (anything that is both inflicted and progresses magically, so a simple burn from a spell wouldn’t really count because the burn itself is mundane, or at least mundanely treated).
    Flavor wounds are a great idea, but realistically speaking, I'm not sure how we would get it implemented. I'd LIKE to have the "diagnose" command be a bit more thorough, and as of current usage, can tell WHEN someone died, what wound killed them and where it was, and can detect SOME coded illnesses (like the burning sickness, when it existed, and the illness of "I idled in the outer bailey courtyard and now I'm shivering oops". That's a favorite). But that would require coding the weapon itself to -inflict- the status of "slashing wound" and such. Most people can just roleplay this by expressing to the healer what happened through page or ooc (eg. Ser A received a spear to the left leg. It went in part way . He expresses this oocly to the healer - Healer can now rp what they need to do, based on the knowledge provided). It's then the job of the players to tell the story. Do we really need to code that? I'd like to say "no" - because resources to code things could better be fit on stuff like upgraded combat, new interesting magic, various interest plots, etc. That's just my opinion. As a player for a healer, I'm content with not having the GAME tell me something that a player can realistically convey. At least, not until such time as a full healing system overhaul might be done.

    • Update the Implement: Probably more realistically, the @woundme system could be updated to have more qualifiers, so rather than just specifying where and how bad the wound is, you would add what type of wound, and any complication could be added then or later depending on circumstances and OOC communication with your Healer.
    I mean, this sort of already exists.

    >@woundme
    Use @woundme '[amount] [location] [comment] ' i.e. @woundme '1 leftarm injured falling down' Amount must be 1 for light wound, 2 for serious wound, 3 for grave wound, or 4 for death. Yes, you can kill yourself with this command AND IT CANNOT BE REVOKED OR UNDONE. Location must be a valid body location from the list at the end of this message. Comment must be a sentence about why you are using the command.

    That sentence spot is prime real estate for describing the type of wound, what weapon, etc. Putting in plenty of information can also allow the healers to doublecheck with the staff, in case the player forgets what they did in the heat of the moment, and they could check on the @woundme assist to see the hows and whys.

    Currently the wounds don’t actively do anything. They limit your combat capabilities, but that’s all appropriately passive. And it should still do that. But a bit more realism would go a long way, I think. This is where the IC knowledge of the wound would become a bit more Healer-specific, because a slashing wound wouldn’t just be a slashing wound. A slashing wound would cause bleeding, which I feel should be a status in itself. Or, let’s use the word symptom. The wound is the problem, and the wound has symptoms, some (if not all) of which need to be treated before the problem of the wound can begin to properly heal.
    This again falls under the idea of Roleplay. This can all be handled in game by proper roleplay, and the wound forcing your combat abilities down is relatively new (it didn't use to make you any weaker. And I have seen people in the deep past @duel with a grave wound and act like they're at full capacity. Hell, I still see it now - people taking hit upon hit in monster combat, never backing down, even though realistically they should be unconscious from the shock of... I dunno... missing hand or something? I mean, a grave wound is pretty grave.). When someone is wounded, and they're "on the mend" it should be the responsibility of the player to reflect that properly.

    You don't walk into a room with your clothes on upside down and say 'Because the game allows me to put my shirt over my cloak, I must be dressed properly". Nah, you gotta set that stuff up yourself. Same goes with healing. If you're not part of the roleplay in properly reflecting your wound, and you're walking without a limp when that grave spear thrust stabbed you yesterday, we can't blame the "lack of in depth healing". We need to take more responsibility for our roleplay. I play a lot of D&D, and I know when I'm wounded in game, this age old system of pen and paper isn't going to do the work for me. I need to role play it. In the end, that's what we are. A roleplaying game, with some implemented systems and checks to make it more "modern", relatively speaking

    So to conclude, I just wanted to preface once again that your ideas are not bad at all. I, too, feel the healing system could use an overhaul, but more along the lines of "more hitpoints to provide a variety of health levels" rather than "let's make it more complex and add different skills". Different in-game skills, i mean. We already have some crafting guilds with 5 different masteries (Clothiers: Hatter, Glover, Cobbler, Embroidery, Tailor, etc) - Healing isn't a craft, not in that sense. It's a science. It's maybe a little bit magic (We're in a castle of dreams, so I like to think maybe that has a point), and it's a little bit fantasy (ok, right now it's a LOT fantasy), but it's still a science. Part of the fun of healing for both patient and healer is the roleplay involved. The game doesn't need to tell me what we the players can create.



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  • Kona
    replied
    Josie_Brennan

    I think bruises and wounds still work like this. So you should be able to stack 5 bruises and be okay...if your character dies I accept no responsibility however lol.

    Originally posted by Odjit View Post
    I'll start off by saying that the following is how bleeding and bruising wounds are layered;

    4 bleeding = death
    5 bruises + 4 bleeding = death
    10 bruises + 3 bleeding = death
    15 bruises + 3 bleeding = death
    20 bruises + 2 bleeding = death
    25 bruises + 2 bleeding = death
    30 bruises + 1 bleeding = death

    Upon your 30th bruise you are issued the following (the same as with your 3rd bleeding wound);

    [WARNING: You are now gravely wounded, and should seek the services of a trained Healer immediately. YOU WILL DIE IF YOU SUSTAIN ONE MORE WOUND. If you die, everything you are carrying at the moment of death will remain on your corpse, which can be looted. Note that if you die in a location that Lith does not service you may not be revived promptly.]

    Upon your 40th bruise you are given this emit:

    You feel exceptionally weak and realise that you could die at any moment. It would be a good idea to find a nurse immediately.

    Past 40 (I went to 100), you get this message and it does not kill you. This beautifully illustrates that while the game code is kind enough not to kill you through bruises? You ARE indeed about to die and should RP accordingly.

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  • Josie_Brennan
    replied
    The only real issues I have with the healing system as is are the following:

    - Bruises stacking up to be fatal after .. I think 5? If I slip and fall on the ice and bruise my butt and legs 5 times, I'm going to be sore and have a hard time on rough terrain, but I'm not going to be bleeding out in a pool of my own guts.

    - Poisons - I feel like this should be a specialty healing kind of situation, something that not necessarily everyone would know how to do. I don't know if the right avenue would be for a new skill outside of regular wound healing or what, but if it were then a boost to that skill that's random (sort of like how teaching is now) for every time you 'treat' someone afflicted with poison might be neat. Players who have RPed and received staff support treating poisons IG before maybe get some BBed skills, but it should definitely be something that requires a hefty investment of time and focus into that specific area. I imagine just like we have 1 Royal Venefice there would be 1 Master Toxicologist (or whatever the era-appropriate term might be), and then a few lesser trained individuals who can handle the more 'common' poisons.

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  • Halvard
    replied
    Originally posted by Kaori View Post
    The problem with your idea (and your idea isn't a bad idea), is that currently there is one healing skill. If we expand the healer system in the way you are saying if we only keep one healer skill then it's just several skill checks on the same skill over and over again for each stage as you described. That to me doesn't sound fun at all.
    I sort of understand this but I also don't at the same time. A skill check is a skill check, regardless of what skill you're using. The only thing that actually changes between two different skill checks is the percentage chance of success because either your skill levels are different, the task is different, or both. The percentage chance of success would be dynamic, in how I imagine the system I laid out because of the variables of wound type, severity, complications, etc.

    Originally posted by Kaori View Post
    Solution 1) Keep only one skill, and have only one skill check to treat the injury. Now though instead of that single check just saying 'Okay this is how long it took you to treat the wound and how long the wound has left to heal' it would also have a random chance of hitting one of your complications that you mentioned. But I don't want to have to hit the same skill multiple times with different commands I would either need to remember or consult notes as any advancement in that single skill is going to make resolving all those checks easier.
    I don't think there can be a single skill check with my system, because if you trigger a complication... then what? You have to make another skill check. Do you automatically fix the complication with that skill check? Then what's the point of the complication? And some of the skill checks would be passive, too, like checking whether you make a mistake and whether or not you notice it. The interesting part isn't supposed to come from using skill checks, rather it is supposed to come from what the results are, and because the percentage chance of success would be to some degree dynamic (and it's still a percentage chance rather than a certainty) the outcome wouldn't be certain

    Originally posted by Kaori View Post
    Solution 2) Split the healing skill up into multiple areas, similar to how many of the other skill groups are. There isn't just one combat skill, or one skill to make clothing, or heck even one skill to use magic. Now it makes sense for multiple commands being needed to treat a wound as each command is hitting a specific skill. IE: Diagnose the wound? That's a skill. Tend to bleed? That's a skill. Tend to burns? That's a skill. What all skills would be needed would depend on exactly what sort of steps are decided to be needed to tend a patient. I don't want more than three skill checks for a "normal" wound (IE: Diagnose skill check, complication specific skill check, and finally bandage wound so healing starts.) Though perhaps more advanced wounds (and I don't just mean grave wounds, but I'm talking special wounds you can't just get from a sword or spear) require a couple more skill checks using more rare skills (like if a spear was poisoned, there would be a skill check needed to look for signs of poison in the system and a skill check for knowing the correct antidote.)

    ....
    I can see why introducing new skills may wind up being necessary, but I think the fewer new skills added, the better. Combat might have multiple skills, but combat is also competitive, and based on a very old system. As it stands, there's probably a few skills that would be made redundant if not for Duel.

    If new skills had to be implemented, I think just splitting them into two would be better than having a skill for each variable. They could be split into trauma and internal medicine. That way, trauma covers things like external bleeding, damaged tissue, broken bones, etc. while internal medicine could cover things like infection, internal bleeding, organ damage, disease, whatever.
    Last edited by Halvard; 08-04-2019, 02:27 PM. Reason: Typo king.

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  • Kaori
    replied
    The problem with your idea (and your idea isn't a bad idea), is that currently there is one healing skill. If we expand the healer system in the way you are saying if we only keep one healer skill then it's just several skill checks on the same skill over and over again for each stage as you described. That to me doesn't sound fun at all.

    Now there are two solutions that I can think of.

    Solution 1) Keep only one skill, and have only one skill check to treat the injury. Now though instead of that single check just saying 'Okay this is how long it took you to treat the wound and how long the wound has left to heal' it would also have a random chance of hitting one of your complications that you mentioned. But I don't want to have to hit the same skill multiple times with different commands I would either need to remember or consult notes as any advancement in that single skill is going to make resolving all those checks easier.

    Solution 2) Split the healing skill up into multiple areas, similar to how many of the other skill groups are. There isn't just one combat skill, or one skill to make clothing, or heck even one skill to use magic. Now it makes sense for multiple commands being needed to treat a wound as each command is hitting a specific skill. IE: Diagnose the wound? That's a skill. Tend to bleed? That's a skill. Tend to burns? That's a skill. What all skills would be needed would depend on exactly what sort of steps are decided to be needed to tend a patient. I don't want more than three skill checks for a "normal" wound (IE: Diagnose skill check, complication specific skill check, and finally bandage wound so healing starts.) Though perhaps more advanced wounds (and I don't just mean grave wounds, but I'm talking special wounds you can't just get from a sword or spear) require a couple more skill checks using more rare skills (like if a spear was poisoned, there would be a skill check needed to look for signs of poison in the system and a skill check for knowing the correct antidote.)

    Now solution 2 is sort of what I like better but it too has its problems. That being, how do you split 1 skill into multiple skills fairly? Let's use three examples:

    First, let's look at Lord Dolph. Let's say he's GM in healing. Do we just simply make him GM in all the new healing skills because he's Lord Dolph and he needs to be able to teach the various skills to the healers? Or does he get GM in many and the rare ones (like perhaps poison identification) are lower? If those rare ones are lower, then what's the course you see for people to gain these rare skills? Remember Dolph may be a lord but he is NOT a VP. He also hasn't even been studying medicine as long as some others in the castle.

    Next, let's look at Diana. Sure she's a nurse now, but she like Dolph is going to have a high healing skill. But she's also been studying healing FAR longer than Dolph. Realistically she's likely to know a few things that Dolph doesn't even know yet. Would she be a good source of some of those rare skills? But keep in mind we only actually have the one skill to look at to decide how good of a healer someone is. So while I might think it's fair to give Diana some more of those rare skills than Dolph, their actual healing skill level might disagree.

    And finally, let's look at Kaori. Nowhere near well trained as either Dolph and Diana. Currently, she's maxed out in training for what a nurse can learn. How do we split the healing skill of someone like her? (I don't mind some new skills now being below what she can learn as that would mean studies again in healing).

    Keep in mind we really only have 3 things to look at when considering a healer and how you might split their single skill up into multiple skills: 1) Their skill level, 2) How long they have been studying healing 3) Story points that the staff decides might be spent during that transition time (They have introduced new skills before and offered a limited time purchase for people that had a good justification for why they should have certain new skills).

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  • Halvard
    replied
    SO.

    I think I made myself clear enough about the idea of what I want, if not the mechanics, but those can be worked out. Obviously in the above scenario, there are quite a few variables. Maybe the level of bleeding is different based on wound severity, and therefore the chance to stop the bleeding is affected. A slight wound has gives a healer a higher chance of stopping the bleeding, and failing to stop it only increases the blood loss every two failures. A serious wound is a lower chance of stopping the bleeding, and the blood loss increases every one failure. A grave wound, again, lowers the chance even more of stopping the bleeding, and increases the blood loss by two for every one failure. At this point bruising should probably only be taken into account to determine the severity of the wound. Having bruises complicate the process more would be too much, if it isn’t too much already.

    But then, the above scenario might have been caused by a Crushing Wound, which would change the process and symptoms. The weapon might be poisoned, which would change the nature of the symptoms depending on the potency and effect of the poison. A Healer might try to hide their mistake. A higher-skilled healer might just get supremely unlucky because that is a thing that happens in the world. Some people die even when you do everything right.

    I have more thoughts but this is way too long already. Hopefully if this system was refined and implemented, it would: make people take wounds more seriously but still allow people to feel safe enough with slight wounds and bruising; it would cut down on confusion between healer and patient (and staff) over what form the wounds take; it would make people less likely to walk around with untreated wounds because the blood loss and chance of infection would increase and therefore threaten them more; I would hope it would add a bit more realism, but most importantly; I think it would provide some great RP potential. Can you imagine if Boreas got stabbed and Dolph failed to treat him successfully? Not that he likely would, but what if that had been a thing that had happened?

    Imagine the potential!

    Try not to imagine the probably enormous amount of work it would require.

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  • Halvard
    replied
    Stage Two: The Wound Effect and the Healing Process

    Now, I am putting these two together because I think they’re intrinsically-linked and easier to explain when able to reference one another. Up until now, it might have seemed like an unnecessary complication to the wound system, and without this part, you would probably be right. After all, there’s only a little bit of benefit to giving more specific wound types if the treatment is still to bandage the thing and wait. And given this is an RP-based game, maybe it’s better it stay that way. I won’t complain (much) if it does. But, ideally, I would like to see some more specific and complex gears being turned. So…
    • What does a wound do? Currently the wounds don’t actively do anything. They limit your combat capabilities, but that’s all appropriately passive. And it should still do that. But a bit more realism would go a long way, I think. This is where the IC knowledge of the wound would become a bit more Healer-specific, because a slashing wound wouldn’t just be a slashing wound. A slashing wound would cause bleeding, which I feel should be a status in itself. Or, let’s use the word symptom. The wound is the problem, and the wound has symptoms, some (if not all) of which need to be treated before the problem of the wound can begin to properly heal. So, the wound would be displayed to an examining Healer, along with the severity, placement and type (eg. serious, chest, slashing) in whatever eye-friendly way the system can do that (maybe as a ‘list’ with the main point being ‘serious slashing wound, chest’ and the sub-points being the symptoms). So, that wound type inflicts the ‘bleeding’ symptom, as well as the ‘damaged tissue’ symptom (or whatever you want to call the symptom that requires stitching the wound closed). These two things would need to be treated individually, because of course they would. I guess you could argue that stitching the wound would stop the blood flow in some cases but I’ve seen enough TV doctors say “We need to stop the bleeding first” to know that I am 100% right about this and I will accept no contradictions, so shut up (but seriously, this is where someone with more actual knowledge would be helpful). Now, given that this is a fantasy setting with a not-modern level of medical knowledge and technology, infection should probably always have a chance of occurring in a base wound. I don’t know enough about the human body to be able to decide on those percentages, but I imagine the chance would increase as the severity increases, and depending on the wound type (so a slashing or piercing wound would have a higher chance of causing infection than a crushing wound because with the crushing wound there was no *heavy breathing* penetration. A crushing wound, however, would have a higher chance of causing internal bleeding, which in itself is an issue because the surface area is likely larger (due to the shape of the implement, meaning more things can be damaged with one impact), it could require surgery to correct (thereby opening the patient to the possibility of infection anyway), and is more likely to break bones (I can’t decide if that would be another symptom or a wound type of its own, both maybe). This system could probably be used to cover diseases as well, at need.
    • How does this affect Healers? Well, this is where your healing skill will become more crucial. Currently, the only difference I am aware of is that lower-skilled Healers increase the recovery time - or rather, they don’t lower the recovery time as much as higher-skilled Healers. Fair enough, that makes sense. But that probably isn’t what you should be thinking about when you’re being treated by Timmy Two-fingers the three-week-old healer with Unskilled (some training). It should be, “Is this novice going to be able to stitch the wound completely? Are they going to be able to identify and prevent infection? Is the fact they only have two fingers going to cause problems here? because I think it probably will. Is there literally any other Healer available? No? Uh oh. But it’s better than nothing.” Now, a way to implement this might be that every time you treat a character’s symptoms, there is a chance (based on your level of skill) that you make a mistake, and don’t realise it. For example, you use the conveniently-made-up command ‘treat Jimothy’s symptom ‘openwound stitches’ and the system takes you on a nice and gruesome process of you doing that, giving off little emotes such as ‘you occasionally have to clear the blood to see where your stitches need to be placed’ or whatever, and eventually you get a message saying ‘you have finished stitching Jimothy’. What comes next will, again, depend on your level of skill. If you’re poorly-skilled and you made a mistake, you might just see a message saying you were successful. If you made a mistake but have at least some skill, you might see the same, but you might also get a message saying ‘you realise your stitching is poor, but they should hold’, or ‘you realise your stitching is poor and the wound will likely re-open’. RP! The patient doesn’t know the stitches are bad unless they’re also a healer, so what do you do? Tell them you messed up and try again? Don’t tell them, but ask a superior healer to fix your mistake? Don’t tell anyone and hope they get better, or blame someone else? Now, a superior healer would be able to inspect the treatment of each symptom and be more likely to see if it was done correctly (the higher your skill, the more likely, where a Grand Master healer would have MAYBE a 1% chance to make/miss a mistake. Each skill level should lower the chance of making mistakes by a significant amount, because there’s probably a mid-range threshold of skill where mistakes aren’t common at all. And mistakes would range from ‘bothersome’ like needing your stitches re-done to ‘pants-shittingly scary’ because now you have a life-threatening infection, all of your orifices are bleeding and you will die if left untreated, or treated poorly once again. Let’s use a complete (but unrefined) example scenario. Anything in [brackets] would be a hidden system message.

    Ser X gets into a fight with a salamander and gets wounded in combat.
    [salamander weapon check: Halberd (slashing wound). Randomised severity and placement]
    A solid hit! Ser X suffers a serious slashing wound to the chest! Ser X is visibly bleeding!

    Ser Snr App Healer inspects ser X’s serious slashing wound to the chest.
    Ser Snr App Healer sees:
    Wound Type: Serious slashing wound, chest.
    Symptom 1: Bleeding
    Symptom 2: Damaged tissue

    Ser Snr App Healer knows from training that the first thing to do is stop the bleeding.
    Ser Snr App Healer takes a sponge from his Healer’s Bag.
    Ser Snr App Healer uses the command ‘treat X’s symptom 1 ‘sponge’.
    Ser Snr App Healer begins to staunch the bleeding.
    [System triggers the process of stopping the bleeding. Time passes while treatment is being administered. Healer skill check. Failed. Ser X’s blood loss goes from 1 to 2. At 10, ser X will die. Ser X’s chance of infection increases.]
    [Healer skill check. Success. Chance of mistake is rolled, no mistake made.]
    Ser Snr App Healer staunches the wound. Ser X is no longer bleeding.

    Ser Snr App Healer now knows that before the 'damaged tissue' wound is stitched closed, it needs to be cleaned (maybe this comes first, I don’t know, I’m a Scientist, Jim, not a Doctor!)
    Ser Snr App Healer takes a leather water jack from his Healer’s Bag.
    Ser Snr App Healer uses the command ‘treat X’s symptom 2 ‘water’.
    Ser Snr App Healer begins to clean the wound.
    [Time passes, emotes happen. Healer skill check. Success. Chance of mistake rolled. Mistake made. Ser X’s chance of infection increases. Chance of Healer noticing mistake rolled. Healer notices mistake.]
    Ser Snr App Healer has an internal struggle because he doesn’t want to be embarrassed about making a mistake and ser X is a bit of a dick.
    Ser Snr App Healer remembers the Hippocratic oath and decides to try to fix the mistake.
    Ser Snr App Healer uses the command ‘treat X’s symptom 2 ‘water’.
    Ser Snr App Healer begins to clean the wound.
    [Again, time passes, emotes. Healer skill check. Success. Chance of infection decreases. Chance of mistake rolled (lowered chance because mistake was identified). No mistake made.]
    Ser Snr App Healer finishes stitching ser X’s serious slashing wound to the chest. Ser X’s wound is closed.
    Ser Snr App Healer breathes a sigh of relief.
    Ser X is still a bit of a dick.
    [Healing process starts. Days until fully healed based on Healer skill. Chance of infection calculated (highest in first 24 hours) and rolled. No infection.]
    [Days pass, chance of infection decreasing each day. No infection rolled.]
    Ser X fully recovers.

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