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  • When Fun Becomes Frustration

    Hmm. Why am I posting this? I know it will probably cause a flame war, not my intention. However, its been boiling inside me for long, and I was wondering if its only me that has that problem, or others share my feelings.

    There is a point in the game when you start getting responsibilities, you start working, people get to know you and you feel great. But then the burden increases, the workload grows and you find yourself invest many many hours in work behind the scenes, instead of actually RPing.

    Those less addicted, get burned out and leave for a while. I admit, I'm an addict and I have this obssession of responsibility and no matter how burned out I felt, I didnt leave. I tried to innovate. Create new things for the game, meet new people.

    I'm not complaining about my work in game, I enjoy it, I dont see it as something I'm stuck with, I see it as something I've earned. But after a while, I feel like my character became one of the characters people only turn to when they need something. Now dont get me wrong, this is not an "I have no friends" whine, I have a point.

    Maybe its just the way I see it, but characters who have responsibilties and grow, become tools in the eyes of others. They work, they get work-related scrolls and have work chats IC.

    Also, sadly, sometimes the players themselves get objectified. Other players see them as someone who will do the job well.

    I'm typing a lot but I noticed I'm failing to express how I feel. When I tell people in private how I feel, most times their reaction is, IC and OOC, "So, leave your jobs, everyone has a replacement". Easily said, and then what?

    I'm feeling a bit lost lately, game wise. I considered just leaving the game many times. Sure, we all have those moments. I took breaks - yes, I took breaks, even though no one noticed.

    I miss RPing. I miss having a conversation that doesnt end with a request - not that I mind requests, those who ask me for things know I usually do it right away.

    I think I'm still not getting my point across, but I just dont know how. I'm burned out, I dont want to leave.

    Anyone else understand how I feel? and if you do, how do you balance? How do you log into the game without simply getting upset the moment you run into anyone, just anyone?

    I'll be happy for some inputs,
    ~Tali
    Mistress Tristana

    Member of Her Majesty's Court
    Embinder/Hairstylist

  • #2
    I don't have characters in job positions, and for that I'm somewhat glad. I can -play- the game I pay for, instead of just working the online job that I pay for.

    That's probably my biggest gripe with the game. Everyone tries to rise up in the ranks, because the only thing any of us really wants is to leave our mark in the castle, so that if the game is still here years down the road, we could log on as a new character and hear "Hey, remember so-and-so and all she did?" and think "That was me! :3 " But, sadly, in order to do this, we have to work in the game, on top of working in real life to pay for this "second job".

    Now, sorry, I know, I'm griping a bit and that's not what you wanted.

    I would say, to deal with the problem, just makes sure you and your character are doing something you like, and if the workload gets to be too much, just tell your superior (even OoC if you have to) that it's too much (and if it's OoC, tell them you're starting to just not have fun in the game anymore and harboring thoughts of quitting). If the person is nice, they'll be understanding and lighten up a bit.

    And then, make sure that you're RPing with people you like to RP with when you're not working. (Even if it's people your character doesn't like, because even that can be fun.)


    As I will constantly, constantly say, this is a game, and games are about having fun.

    Comment


    • #3
      *huggles*

      That's exactly, point for point, why I left the game. Several people have now told me that Rosalind's story is 'over' and there's no point for her to come back, which is a bit depressing because I used to be addicted to the game as well (not a bad thing!).

      I love playing, just wandering around and interacting, but nearly single-handedly running Heraldry burned me out and simply became my character. She was no longer Rosalind with her own, unique personality.

      Especially in the case of Heraldry, there was no one to take over for a long, long time. Heraldry is all but dead now, from what I've been told, which makes me feel a bit guilty. But I simply cannot come back to a workload that's as hard as my RL job and being the only one that does it.

      Great, so everyone says quit. First, that's not very IC to leave my responsibilities. Second, and I know its so selfish, but I got nothing from the work I was doing, no sort of promotion, except job. So Rosalind would be an HG back in the Outer Bailey wearing muslin.

      I didn't think that was a big deal, but everyone else seemed to think that was a horrible way to be. So, I left. Breaks didn't work, I couldn't leave that terrible, difficult job IC'ly...

      My advice is to sort out what you want to keep doing as far as a job in CM and cut out what isn't making you happy or delegate your responsibilities. When I left I know the OB library was pretty well staffed and the hairstylist were doing much better with quite a few members.

      Also, you don't have to have an open bell every day of the week, even though you want to be diligent in your work. People will understand and if its going to lead to promotion, you'll get promoted without being active and working every single day without any of your own RP.

      Comment


      • #4
        I'm not complaining about my work in game, I enjoy it, I dont see it as something I'm stuck with, I see it as something I've earned. But after a while, I feel like my character became one of the characters people only turn to when they need something. Now dont get me wrong, this is not an "I have no friends" whine, I have a point.

        I think I know what you are trying to say.
        You want Tris to be known for something other then her work, to have friends who are friends and not just work.

        Being a healer is a bit like that. No one ever really talked to Des unless they needed her.
        However since taking my break, I have made her make new friends, move in different circles, talk to others.
        Trying to get her involved in more then her job. Tell others you are *off duty* for a while. Try new things.
        Find some plots to get into. It is easy to get burned out if all you do is work and
        nothing else.

        Karen

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: When Fun Becomes Frustration

          Originally posted by Tristana
          I miss RPing. I miss having a conversation that doesnt end with a request - not that I mind requests, those who ask me for things know I usually do it right away.
          You and me both babe. For the longest time what you've been describing is where I am with Di. I rarely rp with her now, but let me qualify that by saying that I consider 'rp' things that don't involve more work. I wish that were not the case, and that it felt like rp when she's working, but it truly doesn't. She feels like a machine, most especially when she's working. The only 'rp' I actually consider rp in the last year has been private rp, where its just one, maybe up to three people in a room with her. Otherwise, she ends up getting asked to do work, I can nearly set my watch by it. Taking her down to the courtyard is a question of only, how many scrolls will I get thrown at me today, and can I get out of here before she's been accosted for more than 5 work related questions.

          Originally posted by Tristana
          I think I'm still not getting my point across, but I just dont know how. I'm burned out, I dont want to leave.
          That's the twisted part of it isn't it. You get burnt out, stop enjoying the rp, and yet you've committed yourself to doing things and you know that if you don't do them no one else will and if you're like me, you hate letting people down out of a 'selfish' desire to quit doing your characters work so you can enjoy your own rp again. So... yeah, it sucks, but at the same time its so easy to lock yourself in like that.

          Originally posted by Tristana
          Anyone else understand how I feel?
          It took me a long time to get her responsibilities down to a lower amount. Unfortunately, in this game its not just a matter of characters but players when seeing responsibility. People who are reliable players tend to get higher positions with more work because their characters get that work done. Go figure, those characters (and hence, those players) have probably run or organized more than one group.

          I have done more work for this game than I ever initially intended, and leaving the positions? Ha, yeah, people have suggested that many times to me in the past. It took me a long time to get to the point where she could leave.

          Di managed to eventually find a replacement for herself in the counsel - and of course, now the person who replaced her is leaving and... go figure, she/I now will are going to be training the new 1st counselor. Heraldry... I have to say that I likely spent as much ooc time training new heralds as I did giving LPA lessons (and that's saying -alot- considering). For a good while, Rosalind handled all the current Heraldry issues, and Di handled training all the new people. Heraldry was just flat out exhausting at times because of how much training is required, and if I remember reading a post correctly about Paul (Mairead) leaving, then ... heh, that means Di will be the only one awake who can train people for Heraldry or act in that capacity til they are done training. Joy. :/ LPA was the same way in a lot of things, very tiring. Not just the lessons, and the constant asking for those, nor the scheduled lectures, I think some of the exhaustion came when she became a board member and started being the Registrar also keeping track of everyone approved to learn and training new Instructors too. I've all but retired her from teaching swords, but at least three times in the past she's been asked to temporarily help a guild as a sword teacher for a few weeks/months, and then of course there are those random requests for lessons that pop up when she happened to be around someone who wanted them, or around another sword teacher who needed to learn or have help teaching a class. Running Royal Orders now gives her lots of things to do, and she's nearly always busy with something going on. Thankfully, she's no longer running Royal Orders, a Herald, LPA Board Registrar, 1st Counselor, and Seamstressing Student -at the same time- as she was before. Being in all those at once wasn't because I wanted to be - it was because it took -ages- to find people a) willing to take on the responsibilities IC and OOC, b) who had the time for it and c) who would go through and finish any training. Amusingly enough, seamstressing and Prosecution were the -least- demanding of all the work she's had, so much so that they easily fell into the category of 'hobby'.

          Now... all that said, I wish I could give you more ... encouragement that it will get easier. It has, to a degree, gotten easier with Di now that I've gotten her to only running 1 group, and doing the other things on the side only when absolutely necessary. But, in the end, it doesn't change the way you may react to people. In my case, it made that a bit more complicated. With her history of the groups she's been in and the positions she moved up to in most, plus the fact that she handles all the charters for all the groups in the castle -- Di can answer questions on ALOT of things, rather unfortunately, that means she gets -constantly- asked questions about stuff she is no longer involved in. I don't mind answering things, honestly, but I do miss rp'ng things that don't involve her current or past works. It's why the chances are good that if I'm actually enjoying rp, its probably in a guest room somewhere where people can't just wander in and start asking things and where I'm able to relax, and just rp some.

          Originally posted by Tristana
          how do you balance? How do you log into the game without simply getting upset the moment you run into anyone, just anyone?
          You may not like the answer I have, but its the only one I -do- have. When I'm playing Di, I tend to only rp with people who have been around the Castle for a good long while, because they don't tend to bombard her with questions about everything since they know the answers already. I also tend to rp her now in closed settings (as I mentioned), like guest rooms or locked offices. I, finally, learned how to say 'No.' Both IC and OOC. Those things make her a little easier to play now, and when I'm in a more private rp setting she can actually be herself, instead of the work machine she is IC - the character is so entirely different privately. I've even named her 'work-mode' as the manner in which she closes off all emotional response, and simply acts the machine.

          I also kept trying and trying until I finally made an alt that I enjoyed. I try to play my alt anytime that Di is really getting to me, and these days, I just play my alt more and more because (as of yet) my alts responsibility in work is practically non-existent. Even when my alt was Watch, that was nothing in even slight comparison to the workload Di had. Playing my alt also lets me interact with the younger character crowd - those same people who would be the ones to need questions answered if I were playing Di.

          So yeah... I guess my answer probably isn't what you -want- to hear. I don't think there is ever an easy fix to it. For a long time logging into the game has been mostly an obligation, something that I drag myself over to do because I -have- to do something IC. Playing my alt has alleviated that somewhat. I'll always adore my main the most, but I can't say I always like playing her.

          ~Nicole
          "A synonym is a word you use when you can't spell the word you first thought of."- Bacharach
          "Education has produced a vast population able to read but unable to distinguish what is worth reading."- Trevelyan
          "There is nobody so irritating as somebody with less intelligence and more sense than we have."- Herold
          "I don't necessarily agree with everything I say."- McLuhan
          "There was never a great genius without a tincture of madness." - Aristotle
          Get Firefox -- My Blog

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          • #6
            Re: Re: When Fun Becomes Frustration

            Alrighty,

            First I want to highlight two of Nicole's points that I think are worth repeating.

            Originally posted by Diedra
            You may not like the answer I have, but its the only one I -do- have. When I'm playing Di, I tend to only rp with people who have been around the Castle for a good long while, because they don't tend to bombard her with questions about everything since they know the answers already. I also tend to rp her now in closed settings (as I mentioned), like guest rooms or locked offices. I, finally, learned how to say 'No.' Both IC and OOC. Those things make her a little easier to play now, and when I'm in a more private rp setting she can actually be herself, instead of the work machine she is IC - the character is so entirely different privately. I've even named her 'work-mode' as the manner in which she closes off all emotional response, and simply acts the machine.

            I also kept trying and trying until I finally made an alt that I enjoyed. I try to play my alt anytime that Di is really getting to me, and these days, I just play my alt more and more because (as of yet) my alts responsibility in work is practically non-existent. Even when my alt was Watch, that was nothing in even slight comparison to the workload Di had. Playing my alt also lets me interact with the younger character crowd - those same people who would be the ones to need questions answered if I were playing Di.

            The IC work I've been doing through Marc clearly doesn't compare to Tristana/Diedra's in either amount or time, but I -do- understand the feeling of "working" rather than "playing". It had me down for a while, but I really feel like I'm out of it. I'll try to share some of the ways I dug myself out of what seemed to be an unsurmountable rut.

            First, I as a player was driven to have Marc succeed. As you all know, Marc was my first stab at this game, and it's the only RPG I've ever even played. That being said, I was goal-oriented as a player, not really understanding the overall scope of the game. Eventually, I began to understand that we're here to tell stories. Not kill ourselves with work. Tali, your feeling is that if Trist doesn't keep up with work, then everything will fall apart..?

            Holy crap! What a great story that would be! People will be -forced- to pitch in to keep things from crumbling, new ideas and leaders can come forth, and then Tristana can return to mentor them? There are countless possiblities that can ensue. It makes no sense to be miserable or play out of obligation. Thing outside the box and have some fun with changing things!

            Another factor that I think contributes to the frustration is mundanity. The same thing over and over and over and over and...So then what? Mix it up! I know this one sounds strange, but put a twist on Trist. Personally, some of the political and intrigue stuff is what pulled me back into the game. And I -assure- you that in the current state of the Castle, there are plenty of opportunities to flow in either of these directions. Less work, more fascinating...in my opinion.

            I think the biggest thing that we need to do is make sure we don't protect our characters. I know we all put in lots of time, and don't want to see anything bad happen to them. But when you can finally loosen the grip and let them roam freely, poke around, and take risks, it's better RP. Less work, more interactions with chars (that doesn't require requests, etc), and more fulfillment.

            Again, these are just my opinions. I hope they help, or at least give you something to chew on.

            Good luck!

            Ryan

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Re: When Fun Becomes Frustration

              Ditto.

              Ditto.

              Ditto. To infinity, even.

              I've left - and subsequently rejoined - this game for the very reasons detailed above as regards my own responsibilities with Sorcha. Between training aspirants - which have to be talented in writing (an ironic challenge in a text based game that exists nonetheless); finding the stories, gathering information, conducting the interviews, writing chronicles, arranging meets, co-ordinating schedules, et al ad infinitum?

              I had no time to just have fun and play. I got burnt out. Not even to mention that the structure of the Office itself doesn't allow for promotion above me - which means that generally A) I've got people constantly undermining things in hopes of becoming Chronicler of the Court or B) I lose great Chroniclers to the Scribes.

              It's not easy. And I could add a third, fourth and even fifth verse to the song, Choirgirls, but I'll spare you.

              Let me ask this theoretically though: If you were both promoted to Courtier (and I am assuming that neither of you have inherent rank of Courtier) and could then train other people to assume your current ranks and yet still be on hand as a mentor, involved in the action but with rank and less responsibility, which therefore would allow for a better influx of blood moving in and about the ranks - would that help?

              It's just an IG idea I've had brewing as Sorcha for awhile as regards the 'working' guilds, per se.

              Curious as to your thoughts.

              Lis.
              The yoke or the throne?

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Re: Re: When Fun Becomes Frustration

                Originally posted by Sorcha
                Let me ask this theoretically though: If you were both promoted to Courtier (and I am assuming that neither of you have inherent rank of Courtier) and could then train other people to assume your current ranks and yet still be on hand as a mentor, involved in the action but with rank and less responsibility, which therefore would allow for a better influx of blood moving in and about the ranks - would that help?

                It's just an IG idea I've had brewing as Sorcha for awhile as regards the 'working' guilds, per se.

                Curious as to your thoughts.
                You said 'if you were both' and I'm not sure what two people you're talking about since several responded But...

                Personally, for Diedra, it wouldn't change anything. Right now, she's an HG and 6th link, but unlike most, she also doesn't want to move to the Inner, so she lives in the Outer. She has a work title that she never uses, though several people around her use it just to annoy her She's been involved in the Inner and politics, and I've pulled her out of that due to getting sick and tired of the OOC problems, which I won't go into. Unless there are major changes, I won't be playing her in the Inner. Granted, if she's -required- to interact with certain people in there, she will, but I tend to keep her out of it as much as I can these days -- which is quite the opposite of how politically involved she was, even though most of it were things she was doing in secret. I have to admit that the loss of ability to play that part of her has killed at least half the enjoyment I had in that character.

                Point being, her being made a courtier... eh, would just mean that she might have to go into the Inner at least once. I've done what I can to take her out of the other groups she's in, and put her more in that mentor type role helping new people take up those positions or training them if she can. That's probably what will continue to happen. She likes to work, just not as much as she was for a good while. IC'ly, working that much had a really really painful effect on her, and OOC it just burned me out. But what I'm doing now is about the best solution that I can find to it. If she were the sort that is easily compatible with more than say ... 3 men in the whole castle, I'd just say I'd marry her off and say end of story on that, but that's not going to happen. It wouldn't phase her in the least to lose her link, but it would bother her to not work at all. As it is, I am pretty sure that if she ever stops having responsibilities (and therefore having any need to wake up/ log her in), I'll just retire her.

                Edit: However, I would say that your suggestion -might- work as preventative. There are just points at which things become too messed up with a character to really patch up without a majorly wonderful thing popping up. I do, truly, hope that some newer players read this and catch themselves before they get caught in the cycle of what -can- happen.

                ~Nicole
                "A synonym is a word you use when you can't spell the word you first thought of."- Bacharach
                "Education has produced a vast population able to read but unable to distinguish what is worth reading."- Trevelyan
                "There is nobody so irritating as somebody with less intelligence and more sense than we have."- Herold
                "I don't necessarily agree with everything I say."- McLuhan
                "There was never a great genius without a tincture of madness." - Aristotle
                Get Firefox -- My Blog

                Comment


                • #9
                  I can empathize.. at one point Fez was:

                  1. Running the Prince's house, doing the job of the valet, equery, bodyservants, and even some of the squire jobs. In addition to building a huge information network to bring info to the Prince and Queen's House. (Which is utterly outside his IC interests)

                  2. Built the Awakeners up to the largest guild in the game.

                  3. Built the Battlers up to the 2nd largest.

                  The result was spending hours every day working. The answer? Fez very actively groomed a protege to run the Awakeners. He made sure members of the Battlers were active and teaching too, not just there to learn, gave them small projects to do, so there were subleaders. And due to lack of support and positive feedback in the Prince's House he left. [Note: Mentoring is the most rewarding thing you can do to ease your workload IG, and also help build the game OOC. Teach others to be leaders and it gives rewards all around]

                  Also, he goes out there and takes chances. It is easy to be a 'hero' and simply go after villains. It is a lot harder to be a 'hero' and go after chars who are part of the system who yours think are a greater danger to the keep. There is so little risk taking done in this game, and that leads to stale stories.

                  I love these threads that have been coming up recently. There are two more I want to start, one on the culture of 'no' and the other on militarization of Marrach. I really think that we as players can help un-stagnate the game, but it really means changing how we RP sometimes... which is damned hard, especially if it can have cost to your chars.

                  Jonathan

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Re: Re: Re: When Fun Becomes Frustration

                    Originally posted by Diedra
                    You said 'if you were both' and I'm not sure what two people you're talking about since several responded But...
                    Sorry about that - yes, I did mean you and Tristana, initially.

                    Personally, for Diedra, it wouldn't change anything. Right now, she's an HG and 6th link, but unlike most, she also doesn't want to move to the Inner, so she lives in the Outer. She has a work title that she never uses, though several people around her use it just to annoy her She's been involved in the Inner and politics, and I've pulled her out of that due to getting sick and tired of the OOC problems, which I won't go into. Unless there are major changes, I won't be playing her in the Inner. Granted, if she's -required- to interact with certain people in there, she will, but I tend to keep her out of it as much as I can these days -- which is quite the opposite of how politically involved she was, even though most of it were things she was doing in secret. I have to admit that the loss of ability to play that part of her has killed at least half the enjoyment I had in that character.


                    I hate to hear as much. But yes, I agree - your situation and motivation may be different for most.

                    From where I sit - there's a lot of stagnancy in some positions - Court Chronicler being one of them. And no motivation for anyone to move beyond. That was closer to my own point.

                    Point being, her being made a courtier... eh, would just mean that she might have to go into the Inner at least once. I've done what I can to take her out of the other groups she's in, and put her more in that mentor type role helping new people take up those positions or training them if she can. That's probably what will continue to happen. She likes to work, just not as much as she was for a good while. IC'ly, working that much had a really really painful effect on her, and OOC it just burned me out.

                    Singing to the choir.

                    But what I'm doing now is about the best solution that I can find to it. If she were the sort that is easily compatible with more than say ... 3 men in the whole castle, I'd just say I'd marry her off and say end of story on that, but that's not going to happen.
                    You found three???

                    Good Gods. I need to get Sorcha out more.

                    And no - the well-equipped courier does not count.


                    It wouldn't phase her in the least to lose her link, but it would bother her to not work at all. As it is, I am pretty sure that if she ever stops having responsibilities (and therefore having any need to wake up/ log her in), I'll just retire her.


                    Hopefully, it won't come to that. Sometimes a brief respite can really do a world of good, and make all things fun again.


                    Edit: However, I would say that your suggestion -might- work as preventative. There are just points at which things become too messed up with a character to really patch up without a majorly wonderful thing popping up. I do, truly, hope that some newer players read this and catch themselves before they get caught in the cycle of what -can- happen.

                    Admittedly I need two of me - one for mentoring, developing, finding souls and training them and one for the actual work of CC. The work gets done, but not enough - unfortunately I can't play 24-7 and be everywhere the news is while its still news.

                    Did I say two? Hell, I need at least three. Three would be perfect and here I can't even find a decent secretary.

                    So. Can the good Doctor clone yet, do you think?

                    The yoke or the throne?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      With Dariel I'm of course in a particular position because I don't create tangible things nor do I render particular services. People who want something from him either come to him with very varied specific needs that he may or may not be able to address or with no idea of what he can and can't do. Which keeps these encounters rare and differentiated enough to still be fun for me.

                      And then, there's the fact that I firmly believe that having a job/responsibility/unique talent doesn't mean you have to serve everyone and anyone with a request. And if they have a request, it doesn't need to be rendered freely, but rather they can be made to make certain concessions in return. This part at least can be transplanted onto almost every guild, job etc. -- the possible exception being everybody directly involved in Law or the Royal Bureaucracy. But especially for crafters and the like, I don't believe a mandate to craft objects for the castle's populace needs to automatically translate into being a prop dispenser.

                      Which people on the one hand seem to agree with (see the recent seamstress strike) but on the other hand seem unsure how to deal with without annoying anybody. Well, I'm pretty sure you can't. At least not without spending even more time explaining to people why they shouldn't just see you as a prop dispenser. Hence, the easiest way to deal with an overabundance of people reducing you to that level is to say no (within reason -- I wouldn't advocate saying no to Boreas for example) and/or make them deserve it.

                      Again, with Dariel I'm in an easier position to make such demands than some others whose services might be available from someone else. In that case, it simply requires a bit of unity behind the scenes. Actual medieval guilds would get together and set the prices on their wares and services together, which would then apply to everyone who practiced their particular craft in that town. The system definitely works.

                      And once people understand not to take these matters for granted, you probably won't get drowned in requests. Just understand and accept that those people who are unwilling to regard you as more as a prop dispenser might get upset. But let's face it... noone likes to deal with someone who regards people as objects anyways.


                      There's another point that adds to people actually being able to get away with this kind of behaviour in the first place, I should mention. The fact that people are too quick to forgive and forget other people. I've seen various instances where a character will treat another character like the scum of the earth one day, and right the very next day, they will make all nice because they want something... and get it, despite their behaviour of the prior day. Now, I have no idea why any character with a shred of pride or dignity would let this happen, but it doesn't really matter.

                      What matters is that people do this. And that others let it happen. After three, four encounters with such pushovers, it's not surprising that people figure they can get everything if they just ask nicely enough, no matter what happened before or whether they should actually be getting it.


                      Now, assuming the problem lies not with the 'victims', what remains is to educate the 'perpetrators'. So, if you get tired of people bothering you cause they want stuff from you, keep saying no if it's not justified. Or make them wait. Or ask for a favour in return. That should stem the tide.


                      Have a nice day.
                      'If you're going through hell, keep going.'
                      -- Winston Churchill

                      POLITENESS, n.
                      The most acceptable hypocrisy.
                      -- Ambrose Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary


                      'Hitler had a good 20 to 30 IQ points on Bush, so comparing Bush to Hitler would in many ways be an insult to Hitler.'

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: When Fun Becomes Frustration

                        Originally posted by Sorcha
                        You found three???

                        Good Gods. I need to get Sorcha out more.

                        And no - the well-equipped courier does not count.
                        *snicker* Yep, one is no longer playing, and the other two play rarely. Two are completely unsuitable for anything official, and one is taken publically. Go figure.

                        Originally posted by Sorcha
                        Can the good Doctor clone yet, do you think?
                        *chuckles* Wouldn't that be nice.
                        "A synonym is a word you use when you can't spell the word you first thought of."- Bacharach
                        "Education has produced a vast population able to read but unable to distinguish what is worth reading."- Trevelyan
                        "There is nobody so irritating as somebody with less intelligence and more sense than we have."- Herold
                        "I don't necessarily agree with everything I say."- McLuhan
                        "There was never a great genius without a tincture of madness." - Aristotle
                        Get Firefox -- My Blog

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                        • #13
                          I'll agree overall with what Dariel was saying about not allowing yourself (either OOC or IC) to be used as a machine.

                          It's also soooooo much easier said than done. For me, it was one of the hardest things for me to start learning to say 'No.' to people IC when I knew by doing that I was inconveniencing the player OOC. But I had to, because for a long while I was bending over backwards, moving my schedule around for everyone else, inconveniencing the hell out of myself, to make sure I didn't do that to other players. It's sometimes hard when you are a player who firmly believes that characters shouldn't be held back because of things their player can't control IRL, but at some point, you have to stop and ask yourself whether or not you are doing too much for other people, and whether or not they are truly doing all they can to work around their own schedule conflicts, rather than expecting that you will.

                          Some things were easier to do than others. As I said, I played my character very political for most of the time (and I'd love to be able to do so again) but, that said, it allowed me to use lots more in positions to either help or hurt a character. So favor was definitely something she learned to weild when it came to people. She's gotten quite a few people into positions, and kept a good number out of them, most times without them being aware of it. That is something that I -absolutely- would suggest people to start doing to add complexity to their stories. It's a social favor game, use it.

                          On that note, some of those people who pissed her off and got on her bad side came direct from requests for language and sword lessons. After months of trying to keep myself as available as I could for -players- who had odd schedules and couldn't do lessons, I started telling people 'No, check the calendar, I have open lectures scheduled at least three times a week.' I also started blacklist banning chars from lessons when they didn't stop harassing after that. I learned to page block constant hassling for lessons, instead of trying to politely decline.

                          Currently, in OoRO, she has to answer questions about the groups and guilds of the Castle. It's her job to be able to do that, and to organize events and monitor the groups, and yadda yadda. I'm not complaining there, at least she's down to just one job finally and she loves what she's doing (granted, she loved almost all of her jobs individually, it was merely the 'all at once' aspect that sucked).

                          Anyway, my point in that is more of a caution to people than anything else. If you are one of those people who has a tendency to go out of your way for other people - its so terribly easy for that to get blown out of proportion. Sometimes, you just have to learn to say 'No.'

                          ~Nicole
                          "A synonym is a word you use when you can't spell the word you first thought of."- Bacharach
                          "Education has produced a vast population able to read but unable to distinguish what is worth reading."- Trevelyan
                          "There is nobody so irritating as somebody with less intelligence and more sense than we have."- Herold
                          "I don't necessarily agree with everything I say."- McLuhan
                          "There was never a great genius without a tincture of madness." - Aristotle
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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Fez
                            [Note: Mentoring is the most rewarding thing you can do to ease your workload IG, and also help build the game OOC. Teach others to be leaders and it gives rewards all around]
                            Absolutely agreed. It really is. While I know Fez/you did tons for the Awakeners (which is a lot of ooc), for me I'm referring to IC particularly and some of the training I've done with characters. Teaching has been absolutely one of the most fun aspects of the game, and I'm thrilled I was able to have my character become a teacher so early on. It has its downsides, as have been discussed, but the rewards of it IC and OOC are really cool. It's not a quick solution to IG time spent, in fact, you spend more time for a good while when you are training them, but in the end, you end up with something even better.

                            IC'ly there are some huge benefits of mentoring also. Aside from just the general pride, there is the fact that if you do a good job of it, they end up in a strong position and will often support you. Another aspect which is great, depending on how personal you get as a mentor, is that these people can often become utterly loyal and protective of your character. In fact, some of the people Di has trained are some extraordinarily skilled swordsmen now who have very geniuinely offered to kill someone just for putting her in a bad mood. Others have more of a political bent, and have offerred in the way of getting someone removed from a position or otherwise outcast socially, or arrested. So, if the fun and pride of mentoring someone isn't a good enough motivator, keep in mind that there are some rather interesting side benefits depending on how well your character manages it

                            Actually this topic reminds me that I need to start reconsidering my Inner avoidance at some point. I've been tossing around some ways of mentoring in a different way as a way to kinda get back into enjoying Di more, but I'd kinda be stuck having to do the Inner thing if I do. *wanders off to ponder more*
                            "A synonym is a word you use when you can't spell the word you first thought of."- Bacharach
                            "Education has produced a vast population able to read but unable to distinguish what is worth reading."- Trevelyan
                            "There is nobody so irritating as somebody with less intelligence and more sense than we have."- Herold
                            "I don't necessarily agree with everything I say."- McLuhan
                            "There was never a great genius without a tincture of madness." - Aristotle
                            Get Firefox -- My Blog

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                            • #15
                              I quit because of this very reason. CM had become a more stressful job then my real job, and my job paid me instead of the other way around.

                              When I quit, I was a jeweler, a knight hopeful, a poet, and I practically was the Battle Guild. It was too much.

                              Now, I'm very very very careful not to fall into that trap. I limit what my character does to the things I like to do as a player. And I don't let things get too hectic, when it does, I take a break.
                              Lovecraft Country: Albert Zero
                              Castle Marrach: Cody the Blade


                              StoryCoder Azrael tells StoryHermit Death, "I *did* get told "you're amazing" by a girl when I was saucing my hotdog..."

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