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  • #16
    Originally posted by Tristana View Post
    This has been brought up before, and I said I am willing to make a list of normal things that should be in there. I think Red and White for example or curly - if of course there isnt an IC reason behind it.
    Tali,

    Think Geist was saying that there are IC reasons why the bodies Doctor G raises have the limitations they do. That is isn't about real world normal. ie.. there may be a reason there is a certain set of traits you see in the people whose bodies were here for the most part.

    Except for Lucus. I blame Lucus on a bad batch of whiskey.

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    • #17
      Actually he said he will check and there might be a reason. If there is, so be it, if there isnt, I'll help
      Mistress Tristana

      Member of Her Majesty's Court
      Embinder/Hairstylist
      Aide for the Healers
      Patron of the Embinders
      Scribe of the Chambers

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      • #18
        The original char gen I came across when I started had -everything-.

        If you wanted to start with lustrous silver hair worn in a beehive - you could.

        I think the textures and styles should be fairly bland. You've been dead afterall. You won't unravel looking like a beauty queen.

        Though, what could be neat would be char-gen specific colours that you can't get through a hairstylist. No idea what those could be at the moment, but it was just a random thought.

        Textures currently are - while bland - limited. As with Euphelia's bit on the curly hair. All the nappy textures are there, but we're lacking things like curly, wavy, straight <- Some very basic stuff.

        Colours, ya. I agree with not being able to start with white hair is sorta silly. I think it should be restricted to the simple colours - blonde, red, black, brown, white and maybe one or two variations of each. sandy, copper, coal-black, dark-brown, grey, maybe silver.

        But none of the fancy stuff like flame-red, vanilla-blonde, frosted-blonde etc.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Fez View Post
          I blame Lucus on a bad batch of whiskey.
          I blame my marriage on the same thing.
          This world is made of Love and Peace! Love and Peace! Love and Peace!!!-- Vash the Stampede

          CM is the abusive spouse of gaming. It really loves you and it -was- kind of your fault you fell down the stairs twice in a row.-- Wisdom Incarnate.

          I want to ask who we should submit our FMM to so that they can be evaluated for hilarity before we post them.-- More Wisdom. Different Incarnate

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Geist View Post
            I believe that's true. Does anyone remember exactly when the limited selection went into place so I can do some research as to why beyond what I anecdotally know? Again, my gut reaction would be that the list is deliberately limited rather than somehow "deficient" or "lacking". I think people should consider the implications of saying that Doc G apparently hasn't raised up anyone with curley hair since the New Awakenings, for example.[/FONT]
            I got the impression the limitation was just "Well cut them all at X skill level" ? As far as I could tell, it was a mechanics issue - too much trouble making individual styles, colors, and textures available from different skill levels.

            Originally posted by Fez View Post
            Tali,

            Think Geist was saying that there are IC reasons why the bodies Doctor G raises have the limitations they do. That is isn't about real world normal. ie.. there may be a reason there is a certain set of traits you see in the people whose bodies were here for the most part.
            That doesn't hold water. The IC limitations have only existed for 2-3 years, then? And they are somehow mysteriously lifted for OOC reasons (storypoints) ? If the limitation was IC, then I don't see how it could be lifted by anything except IC reasons. Doctor G has given people hairs of all colors, until he suddenly stopped.

            I'm pretty firmly of the opinion it's a matter of mechanics and code getting in the way of what makes sense IC. That happens all the time.


            Oh yeah, can you currently start with any sort of blonde hair? Sandy doesn't count.

            Edit: Oh, and I'd guess early 2003, maybe very late 2002 (October or onward) for the change in the chargen hairstyles. I don't think any of my characters after Priam had as much choices available.
            Priam: You know what's a bad idea?
            Kyramor: Not usually

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Geist View Post
              I've never heard of anyone saying that it was OOCly all right to "make up for the limitations" of character generation. I think the limitationsa are deliberate, for one reason or another. The lack of certain colors or styles or textures are I believe something you are supposd to ICly quirk your eyebrow at. That is my understanding at least.
              Originally posted by Tristana View Post
              Stylists players were basically told its alright to help players cover for those lackings by oocly changing hair colors before the character actually emerges to normal hair colors that the chargen is missing.
              In addition to what Tali is saying, I know I was told two seperate times by a staffer that it was fine to have a certain starting hair color as long as I worked it out with a stylist before the character was played.
              Originally posted by Priam View Post
              That doesn't hold water. The IC limitations have only existed for 2-3 years, then? And they are somehow mysteriously lifted for OOC reasons (storypoints) ? If the limitation was IC, then I don't see how it could be lifted by anything except IC reasons. Doctor G has given people hairs of all colors, until he suddenly stopped.

              I'm pretty firmly of the opinion it's a matter of mechanics and code getting in the way of what makes sense IC. That happens all the time.
              Exactly how it comes off to me also. Since it used to have all the options you could get in game, I don't see why we don't have those options now. I see no real purpose in limiting it and making people have to individually OOC seek out stylists or pay SP's for a hairdo.
              Originally posted by Priam View Post
              Oh yeah, can you currently start with any sort of blonde hair? Sandy doesn't count.
              That I recall... I don't think so. I know I wanted blonde for my alt I made a couple of years ago but ended up with sandy, so probably not.

              ~Nicole
              "A synonym is a word you use when you can't spell the word you first thought of."- Bacharach
              "Education has produced a vast population able to read but unable to distinguish what is worth reading."- Trevelyan
              "There is nobody so irritating as somebody with less intelligence and more sense than we have."- Herold
              "I don't necessarily agree with everything I say."- McLuhan
              "There was never a great genius without a tincture of madness." - Aristotle
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              • #22
                I do believe my character is the one who started this little thread. I made a brand new character and to my surprise the char gen is disturbing lacking of colors. No red, no white, no blonde, no auburn. Lacking of textures like culy or straight and all sorts of things. I've been playing in this game for near five years and back in my day (thats right, I went there), you could have silver, white blonde, platinum, auburn. And if I recall correctly, the reason that they started taking away the colors was because the hairstylists were getting updated and some one was making a big deal about high linked colors occuring naturally. From what I recall, it was an ooc reason more than anything else as to why the char gen is seriously lacking variety. So, I got a stylist (who shall remain nameless) to change my character's hair before I ever played this new character. I didn't make his hair cinnamon red with highlights. It's vanilla-blonde which to me is basically a fancy way of saying white blonde. So, why would I ever pay storypoints for something I could get free? It wouldn't make sense to pay 30 story points for vanilla blonde when I'd probably be directed to a stylist to an ooc switcharoo anyway. I wasn't going to waste points for free and yes I do plan on playing this character as having natural vanilla blonde hair. If theres a character running around with blue hair, then my vanilla blondeness shouldn't be a big deal.

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                • #23
                  I see nothing wrong with how you handled Leesil's hair, people have been doing it that way for a good while. If you wanted something unavailable from a stylist, then you would've needed to go the route of points. My character noticed it IC and it didn't even remotely spark some sort of thought that the Doc messed up or made an exception. It's just blonde hair after all, albeit a beautiful color blonde. Of course, who knows, maybe the fact that she didn't think that is rooted in her odd longtime love of men with uniquely hued blonde hair (drooling over Priam and Dannions hair come to mind).
                  "A synonym is a word you use when you can't spell the word you first thought of."- Bacharach
                  "Education has produced a vast population able to read but unable to distinguish what is worth reading."- Trevelyan
                  "There is nobody so irritating as somebody with less intelligence and more sense than we have."- Herold
                  "I don't necessarily agree with everything I say."- McLuhan
                  "There was never a great genius without a tincture of madness." - Aristotle
                  Get Firefox -- My Blog

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                  • #24
                    A suggestion; Why not make all (or most) of the 11th link styles available in chargen? That would, at least to me, make far more sense. Or, go the other way, and make it so that all the 11th link colours are available (as well as some logical naturals that may not be 11th link), but all the textures and styles are nappy. That would encourage newlies to seek out a hairstylist, thus prompted RP.
                    This space for rent.

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                    • #25
                      Curly is not eleventh link. I am between agreeing with that and not agreeing with it - I can understand both sides. To make someone's hair be curly when it is not natural takes a lot of work. But at the same time, it limits those who want naturally curly. Like meeee.

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                      • #26
                        There's a huge can of worms in this argument.

                        It it's okay to go in and do someone's hair before they ever emerge from their room, is it also okay to give them clothing for example? What about training them in certain skills? Of course, I can see how this could be used to craft some kind of storyline (though none that would interest me as I think about it) but I mostly see a disadvantage to it -- one that is blurred even more by being able to pay StoryPoints to achieve the same effect.

                        It upholds the illusion that skills are important to the game as a whole. Despite my frustration at the lack of support the Sorcery skillset has gotten over the past 5 years, they're not. It further supports the illusion that the chain of being is some sort of levelling table and once you make it to 1st Link you've won the game, with new 'levels' opening up new 'enhancements' for your character (clothes, hairdos, whatever). Of course, such rigid classifications as curly hair not being a basic texture (both in chargen and with stylists apparently, to which I only say: WTF?) further reinforce this view.


                        And that view alone IMO makes up for at least a third of all the idiocy I encounter in the game.
                        'If you're going through hell, keep going.'
                        -- Winston Churchill

                        POLITENESS, n.
                        The most acceptable hypocrisy.
                        -- Ambrose Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary


                        'Hitler had a good 20 to 30 IQ points on Bush, so comparing Bush to Hitler would in many ways be an insult to Hitler.'

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                        • #27
                          I'm sorry but this is getting absurd. I dont know why they reduced the options in chargen, but I hardly doubt its because someone was bitching at the guidelines, or about fancy hair - because there are colors there, say Copper, that for a while were 6th link by guidelines, so your argument is way off.

                          And why wont we just give everyone the hair they want? why have hairstylists? or have them have guidelilnes? or bother to do their job? or rp? or restrict high materials in order to reward those who work hard, got promotions and are in high ranking positions?

                          I'm sorry if I get annoyed here, and you might think the whole stylists work for me is just typing ALTER MY HAIR 'X'. Well think again! This is really begining to annoy me. I work really hard to find new things to add to parser, in order to give more to every single link in the castle, rearraging the guidelines last time wasnt exactly easy either, and then you all go and diss it because you cant have your char work a bit harder for some nicer hair?

                          I said I understand its frustrating, but come on. So from now on I can either look at it as crossover or immedietly have Trist ban people who have hair above 11th link, chargen or not, and then I will be completely absurd, wont I? Its not a threat or anything, this is how I react when people take my work and step on it and then walks on by.

                          And Lucus' hair is not an excuse. His whole character is based on his hair, I dont see how being another shade of a redhead can effect someone's story.

                          Have a nice day,
                          Mistress Tristana

                          Member of Her Majesty's Court
                          Embinder/Hairstylist
                          Aide for the Healers
                          Patron of the Embinders
                          Scribe of the Chambers

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                          • #28
                            Actually I can fully understand your point when it refers to textures and colors. You've just awoken from the dead so your hair isn't going to be all that shiny or lush or willowy. You aren't going to wake up with braided hair or pigtails. It's a miracle that Dr. G woke you up with all your limbs in tact.

                            Color is something different entirely. There are like 10 colors in the character gen and I highly doubt that Dr. G is nickpicking who has what hair color to awaken. It honestly -doesn't- seem like an IC reason as to why thats the case. Personally, I think all the hair colors should be allowed. It makes no sense to think that Dr. G is purposefully ignoring waking up red heads and blondes or white haired old biddies.

                            I would totally understand if I played my character for a week or so with brown hair then it automatically turned purple and claimed it was his natural color. But I didn't.

                            And again: Why pay points for the same result if I can get it free. This isn't skills or clothes we're talking about here. It's hair color.

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                            • #29
                              Oh its just hair color.

                              No, I'm sorry but no. This is the problem, that people dont look at the hairstylists as a craft as a whole.

                              Sure, there should be all colors available on char gen. All natural colors. White blonde? sure. Vanilla is artificial, ICly mixed by one of the stylists. It wasnt in the game, it was something thought about and added later.

                              You wouldnt have see my reaction turn into this if you changed it to a natural hair color that doesnt appear in the chargen.

                              You get it for free, because sadly, no one screams crossover, because after all its just hair, right?

                              Now I better stop typing because I'm really mad and I dont want to say something stupid.
                              Mistress Tristana

                              Member of Her Majesty's Court
                              Embinder/Hairstylist
                              Aide for the Healers
                              Patron of the Embinders
                              Scribe of the Chambers

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                I am sorry but I do have to agree there has to be a limit. I do believe too that Lucus' player paide stroypoints for that hair and has a heck of story that surrounds it. But I am with Fez. We can just state clearily that what is on character gen is what we consider to be natual, since as Geist stated there might be a point to it. It could actually have some bareing on the Main plot. So Tristana would just make a note on the Public Twiki and state here clearily that all the Stylist will abid by what the Character gen has stated is a natural color. People that have strange colors done and approved through storypoints have got to let you know so that you can include their name on twiki for the stylist to see so there is no agrument over it.
                                Finna Moon, Courtier to Her Majesty's Court




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