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Unofficial poll: The nerfing of staves

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  • Unofficial poll: The nerfing of staves

    This has been discussed in numerous threads, but it's become a huge balance issue: staves.

    When two players with one weapon, each about 500/100 in their weapon and 500/150 in CMs, and 200/100 in shields, can't fend off a staver for more than a few minutes, there is a problem.

    There really is no point in picking any other weapon. Staves win. The unblockable sweep, the triple hitters, etc.

    I like that skillsets are still being tweaked and updated, but seriously? When the best combat players in the game with insane ranks give up their go-to weapon to learn staves...there is a problem.
    3
    Nerf the F out of it and call it a day
    33.33%
    1
    Make it "fair" and have as many holes as other weapons
    0%
    0
    Leave it as is so someone 100/100 can dominate someone with 10x the ranks
    33.33%
    1
    Actually address combat balance.........
    33.33%
    1
    Last edited by Tale; 12-24-2017, 07:08 AM.

  • #2
    Staves have already had all the balancing they need. The parting moves were adjusted to be slower to be more in line with other weapons. Sweep is not unblock-able by any stretch and is actually more penalized that you might think. Defensive sweep and stepping spin were also adjusted in speed to be more in line with other weapons and to made far less abusable. I can assure you that staves do have holes in their defense, but I am not going to elaborate on what those are. Some weapons just do not do well against other weapons.

    As it stands, combat is very well balanced and staves are not likely to change any time soon.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Pranzor View Post
      As it stands, combat is very well balanced and staves are not likely to change any time soon.
      I appreciate the response, Pranzor. As someone that normally doesn't complain or gripe about mechanics in the game, I put this post up after numerous experiences that run contrary to what has been stated. I know plenty of people that have abandoned weapons with thousands of ranks to learn staves. My character has fought stavers with a wide range of ranks and never done well, despite a decent amount of PvP experience. I know I'm not the only player that feels this way.

      I have also player characters that were stavers and it's night and day difference than my last staver. The community has said they'd like to have an open conversation about weapon balancing and bugs. Let us help.

      Comment


      • #4
        First point, this is not an official poll, since only the staff can make official anything, players can only do unofficial polls, so change the title to reflect that.

        Second point, staves are not the be-all-end-all of weapons, they're designed to be super defensive, always have been, and have received the most attention of any skill set, so are the most well balanced skillset in the game.

        Third point, I've personally beaten the crap out of a few stave users, pretty handily too. As was stated, some weapons don't do well against certain other weapons, and some do. Like a knife against unarmed, the knife has the advantage.... a two handed axe against a club, the axe would probably cut the clubber in half... but a stave versus a knife, the staver will usually win.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by ArchMagi View Post
          First point, this is not an official poll, since only the staff can make official anything, players can only do unofficial polls, so change the title to reflect that.

          Second point, staves are not the be-all-end-all of weapons, they're designed to be super defensive, always have been, and have received the most attention of any skill set, so are the most well balanced skillset in the game.

          Third point, I've personally beaten the crap out of a few stave users, pretty handily too. As was stated, some weapons don't do well against certain other weapons, and some do. Like a knife against unarmed, the knife has the advantage.... a two handed axe against a club, the axe would probably cut the clubber in half... but a stave versus a knife, the staver will usually win.
          That's not really true. Knives have a decent matchup against Staves, its one of the few positive match-ups a knifer has. Wouldn't say it's Knives favored, it just is a lot more even and depends severely on the ranks of the people fighting and the stats. Though, stavers will probably always win just because of stance changing attacks.

          This game really is purely matchup based however, and the simple truth is.. One-Handed crushing has possibly more bad matchups than Knives themselves. Your weapon is severely weak both offensively and defensively. Lots of stuns for group jumping someone in berserk but as for 1v1, not really good.

          For the record, I didn't give up Knives. I simply reached a point where going any further was pointless and went on to a new weapon that would have more favorable matchups against the weapons Knives suck against. I wouldn't say Staves themselves are the problem, (Even Spears are insane when they aren't in a terrible matchup for the weapon). I firmly believe that stance changers need to be given to -every- weapon which would almost instantly balance out the game fully. Or, stance changers need to be firmly removed from the game entirely like before Japes came along. They were fine on paper to give weaker weapons a chance to compete, but if things on paper always came out how we wanted. Some of these NFL/NBA teams wouldn't suck so badly.

          Thing about Staves is, unlike other weapons. They have no firm bad matchup for them other than another Staver. Everything for a good Staver is a pretty even or positive matchup as it is.

          Comment


          • #6
            every combat skill set in the game can take out every other combat skill set in the game, if you know what you're doing, and the other person doesn't.... ranks give an advantage, but actual skill can beat ranks, as long as you have a chance with your ranks, and aren't swinging 95's in berserk.

            Comment


            • #7
              Staves are not that bad right now after the previous nerfs, I can think of people with at least 5 weapons who would destroy two people with those ranks.

              Comment


              • #8
                Hundreds of ranks in basic and sub-skills will not do it. If you don't got good stats to accompany those ranks, you will get owned to those who have tons of ranks + maxed stats + knows what they're doin with their weapons.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I got knocked to -15 HP with having 140 hp with 4 hits from Arteus the other day....

                  I wish i could do that a pardelian user, 155hp in 4 hits. Can it be done? Can it be done with clubs, or one handed axes?

                  Not to mention, I was hit in a few crappy places, like 1 of those "hits" was a single hit to my right hand.

                  Then 3 more attacks after that, took a total of 155HP

                  and he wasn't even using an Altene doublemace, it was a bronze or iron capped stave.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    yep, it can be done, all you need is to outclass your opponent, have a good weapon, and get lucky 4 times in a row with devastating critical hits.
                    Most of the time, you're looking at 3-4 hp per shot, in an even match, with no critical hits. Soon as you outclass your opponent though, you do some serious damage.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by yezrah7 View Post
                      I got knocked to -15 HP with having 140 hp with 4 hits from Arteus the other day....

                      I wish i could do that a pardelian user, 155hp in 4 hits. Can it be done? Can it be done with clubs, or one handed axes?

                      Not to mention, I was hit in a few crappy places, like 1 of those "hits" was a single hit to my right hand.

                      Then 3 more attacks after that, took a total of 155HP

                      and he wasn't even using an Altene doublemace, it was a bronze or iron capped stave.
                      Uhh... One of the only fights Syden and Ciaran have had. I took him from half hp to KO in one hit with Knives. That has nothing to do with 'Staves' being overpowered. Prone crits win game. Specifically ones that land on body parts that enchant damage such as a neck hit. In fact, till that hit I was likely going to lose the fight.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Well your case was a special case, remember Arteus is old he is not great but he did happen to be in a stance which made him more than aggressive, with a sweepstrike and a spinstrike and multiple warnings and GM's messaging me.. It was a superior iron capped stave btw. would have been worse with the double mace. Not to mention I had like the best rolls ever but the words tread lightly came across and the character in question was prone or laying..
                        oh and remember laying look at your agility, speed etc. all your stats change. Arteus was still standing.
                        blank kills you with blank's bare hands.
                        You are slain.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I just thought that was a lot of damage to deal in 4 attacks, when 1 of those attacks was an bruise to my right hand. So really, you did all that damage in 3 attacks.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by yezrah7 View Post
                            I just thought that was a lot of damage to deal in 4 attacks, when 1 of those attacks was an bruise to my right hand. So really, you did all that damage in 3 attacks.
                            With the right role and a prone opponent its not difficult to do 100hp in one attack, once again not an issue with staves but a weapon wide mechanic of crits/prone targets.
                            Tale responds from afar, "Decided to give out t-shirts to all the people I murder. Three so far. This way you can all say, "Tale murdered me! .....and all I got was this stupid t-shirt!!""

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Not sure if you meant this as a poll to be taken seriously or not, the options certainly don't appear to serious. This is less of a poll and more of a gripe post.
                              Tale responds from afar, "Decided to give out t-shirts to all the people I murder. Three so far. This way you can all say, "Tale murdered me! .....and all I got was this stupid t-shirt!!""

                              Comment

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