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Tears for Fears?

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  • Tears for Fears?

    Does Superstitious Fears prevent you from opening tears?
    Those who are afraid of the dark have never seen what the light can do.

  • #2
    Unless it's changed, no, you can still open tears. The only issue is you can't hold them in your hands aside from when you first search an amphora. After you put it in your sack you wont be able to take it out, but can still crack it there I think.

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    • #3
      Thanks. Appreciate the info.
      Those who are afraid of the dark have never seen what the light can do.

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      • #4
        Update. One cannot take from the amphorae if one has "Superstitious Fears".
        Those who are afraid of the dark have never seen what the light can do.

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        • #5
          That is excellent news, no more taking superstitious fears and having no down side.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by ArchMagi View Post
            That is excellent news, no more taking superstitious fears and having no down side.
            Considering the current state of tears, still no down side

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            • #7
              Tears really should be made better. I've always thought it was silly that the crime orgs in game didn't have the black market cornered on that. Unlike hoods/masks which are ridiculously expensive contraband and rare with opportunities to obtain (like with 2k RPs or special GM events typically), tears should be able to be farmed on a regular basis. This theoretically should have lead to the crime orgs in game having a base of what they would offer to buy the tears for from others outside the org, and then another base price of what they would sell them for to everyone else. As one of the only illegal but feasibly obtainable types of contraband in the game, I've always felt there was a bit of a missed opportunity there.
              Originally posted by Marren
              YOU CAN'T HIDE CRAZY WITH MAKEUP, I PROMISE YOU.

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              • #8
                Why would crime orgs unless they controlled that area have anything to do with tears
                "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

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                • #9
                  Why would crime orgs want anything to do with illegal objects and RP? Beats me.
                  Originally posted by Marren
                  YOU CAN'T HIDE CRAZY WITH MAKEUP, I PROMISE YOU.

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                  • #10
                    I understand your statement and I get your sarcasm but itís the open world uncontrolled atm by any crime org open for anyone to claim including crime groups . So yes in theory a crime could take over good luck being 24 7
                    "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

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                    • #11
                      Hmm... I must not be explaining this idea well. In my opinion, Harbor Rats have done hits outside of the Harbor, and operated outside of their own turf whenever they want to ply their thieving trade. Same with the Black Centurions, I sincerely doubt their thieves are stealing within their own territory and I'm reasonably sure they've done hits that were outside of the Steps themselves. As such, while their turf is in one area, they're certainly free to roam the gameworld and look for other methods of obtaining profit.

                      This is an area where I looked at it in the context of how real world mafias, gangs, and other crime organizations operate. Any time something that people want is made contraband, a black market tends to emerge in one way or another. Prostitution, drugs, illegal documents (fake passports and whatnot) are all avenues making them a fortune. In this game, the only real contraband items are things like a Constable Medallion, Legio equipment (which is basically useless due to the contraband nature and penalties), hoods/masks, and tears. Out of those options, tears are the only real farmable option in the way that manufacturing drugs would be for a real life crime group. Farmable in the sense that you can continue to acquire more on a regular basis and distribute them accordingly, have solid options on regularly buying from select people, and then building a client base to sell to. No one is sitting there accumulating 2k RPs quickly just to make hoods and sell them on the black market, and there really isn't a reliable way to do it outside of that. There really isn't demand for Legio/Constable gear, on top of the danger/difficulty of obtaining that, so those avenues were shut down too. The main thing holding tears back at this point was how hard they were nerfed.

                      I've trained many non-com skills from level 1 on a character that already had respectable combat ranks, putting that non-com way back in skill slots, making it tedious and boring to advance with it. I sincerely doubt that I'm the only person who has done that and would've liked a market to buy up tears to accelerate that learning.

                      So, if I were to make a suggestion here, would be to make tears have a longer shelf life and make the nightmare ones less frequent. If tears could be brought back to being viable again, it would really open up a lot of opportunities for role play all the way around.
                      Originally posted by Marren
                      YOU CAN'T HIDE CRAZY WITH MAKEUP, I PROMISE YOU.

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                      • #12
                        That makes much more sense, tears lasting longer and less nightmares sounds good. There used to be someone you could pay to farm for you if they
                        lasted longer you could make profit
                        "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

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                        • #13
                          If they were better, maybe.But we're probably talking about a tiny profit margin. You're either strongarming the hunting grounds and monopolizing the market output, or you're paying someone to collect them.

                          If it's the first option, the GM's are probably going to tell you to take it back home. This has happened before. There's even been instances where holdings have been removed, because they were retroactively deemed to be slightly outside of 'territory'. It would also take an incredible amount of work to fight off everyone else pursuing something awesome, and I'd have to wonder if the profit margins and grief would even be worth it.

                          The second, I'd have to wonder why the person collecting them wouldn't just sell it themselves. We're talking about a drover trip keeping them away from more money. I guess a crime org could offer to buy all of them for a bulk price, but if the seller has a market, he'd make far more doing everything. I guess a crime org could go and beat him up, attempt to get him to fall in line. But again, would it be worth the grief?

                          It's a lot of work for an established crime org to go out of its way to do for the sake of it being crime. I think the best bet for something like this to work would be an external group collecting, setting the value, and smuggling them into the city. Something new and dedicated to the market. Probably a group of people who already like doing it, then you wouldn't even need to strongarm the market, it'd just be extra income on tears they don't want, and you wouldn't have to worry about territory disputes.
                          Originally posted by MrSelfDestruct
                          I thought it was just a rumor that it was all number-crunching and competitive training in a game with no logical endpoint since characters are ostensibly immortal and can always get better.

                          You mean it's true?
                          Originally posted by Phwoar
                          Maybe I'm just becoming some tea-sipping hippy, or maybe I'm sour because my main uses cesti, but, why sacrifice a character idea for the sake of some hypothetical edge in some imagined combat situation in the distant future?
                          Originally posted by Elowynn
                          Rupert is like the Snowden champion of TEC.

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                          • #14
                            I mean as a business opportunity, and assuming tears lasted much longer or indefinitely, to increase your supply to be able to meet any demand what makes sense off the top of my head would be to run newbies through and pay them for just grabbing extra tears. The main limitation for "farming" is the amount of you can grab per character. A single person cannot increase their output.

                            So get a solid 2-3 fighters (I assume already work in this group/org). Approach 'newbies' (if we really even have any of those) who likely don't make that much money. Pay them 1t (cause it sounds like a decent amount) to just follow you and grab the 8(?) tears you can get in a single trip of hitting each hunting ground. If 8 tears cost you 1t, then 1 tear = ~200d. Maybe bump it up if you're paying for drover tickets or whatever. Sell each tear for 500d to 1000d to make a decent profit. Including the fighters, with 2 newbies you can farm like 32-40 tears per trip? Which if you sold each tear for even 500d would be +12t worth of tears per trip. Minus a few nightmares, but it could still be worth it.

                            But I myself am a returning player, so my numbers could be off. Just interesting to think about. Yeah, would be awesome if they lasted longer.
                            A woman in a shiny boison helmet with an absurdly tall dome says to a ram in Cineran, "Oh yes, hit me now, you bad bad bad sheep."
                            A woman in a shiny boison helmet with an absurdly tall dome is stunned.
                            A ram bumps roughly into a woman in a shiny boison helmet with an absurdly tall dome with its head!.


                            “Everybody in this country should learn how to program a computer... because it teaches you how to think.” - Steve Jobs

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                            • #15
                              There's so much potential for tears, but currently they're practically worthless. They're relatively hard to get, and become more difficult with the more people you bring. Traits and stats matter. There's a weekly (real time) jail sentence and they degrade over time, fairly quickly. If I'm lucky I can fly through the BG and Tower in 30 minutes. Large tears, once you hit min gains can net you anywhere from 1.5 - 3 SP every hour. If you're unlucky and snag a nightmare tear then you're afk'n in the baths for 30-45 minutes recovering and might as well spent that 30 minutes that it took to farm them, min maxing. It's best to crack them when you're low fatigue and at the beginning of the cycle, especially if you want to work on non coms. I personally farm them 2-3 times a week for my character, and bring 2-3 people at separate times to buy their tears off of them.

                              I used to buy them for a talent a piece, but now that they're not really worth it, I pay around 2000 denar for all 5 of them, unknowing if there's a nightmare or 5 within the batch I just bought. I use them for GSP, because you can get better SP by cracking a large tear for 4.5 GSP each time, no matter if you're on min gains or not. That is the only benefit I see with tears currently. That, and access to the Nehal Village, which I guess is cool, though there's not much there. 2ha trainers are everywhere. And if you want to reforge a weapon from them, you simply need -1- tear.

                              Also, you can't bring in newbies to these hunting grounds. It's possible, but the risk of them going KO is very likely, especially if they're not familiar with what to do. Getting by turtles, slugs, stalkers and scarabs all require high speed. If you can't get by after a short amount of time, the turtles will start hitting you much easier. You can have 1000 ranks in leg dodge and you'll still be hit with 5's eventually. Add that to the fact that they hit very hard, newbies, or even veteran characters can be in for a tough trip.

                              There's a -potential- huge market for tears though. I tried years ago to get a black market going, when they were awesome. Was tough getting it started and I ultimately gave up, but it was a fun few weeks. People are scared of them due to the hefty jail sentence that comes along with them. If I remember right, it's 1 week -per tear-.

                              Making tears great again, or at least somewhat feasible wouldn't be to difficult..

                              1. Give back the ability to see if it's a nightmare tear or not. Having the ability to make sure what you sold to Mr. Newbie isn't going to harm them would be a huge bonus to selling and moving them around. There were, and likely still are ways IG to find out if what you have is a nightmare or not, but they were silly and OOC. There are currently 5 types of tears gathered from amphoras. Gladius, Forge, Tree, Shadow and River. Nightmares are hidden in all 5 of them. Why not remove them from those, and just add a 6th type of tear gathered from the amphora's with the same likelihood of gathering the others. 18.5% chance basically.

                              2. Either remove, or lengthen the time on how quickly they downgrade. I get the purpose of it, but with the SP being contributed to your current cycle's SP, it's not really a major concern for abuse. - Sure someone could buy or farm 20 river tears and spend 1 full cycle popping them back to back every hour, but the SP gathered goes down drastically after the first few tears. You'll obtain more SP by removing and applying bandages in a 1 hour span then you will by popping the 5th or 6th tear in the cycle, assuming you haven't bothered to train any other skills as well.

                              3. Fix the resting place, if it's still broken. Last time I checked, grant it, this was years ago.. The resting place was practically impossible. Awesome mechanics, but too difficult. Give characters that haven't invested 5+ years and thousands of ranks in combat the chance at farming them. There's 4 tears in there, and 5 combined in the BG/Tower - Almost half of the tears aren't even capable of being farmed. (Unless the resting place has changed and made easier)


                              Lastly, crime orgs don't need territory's to get in to the market. That's not really how it works. If money is to be made by doing things that the average Jo won't do, then you can bet someone is going to do it, and capitalize off of it. If the TG, BC or whoever came to me and asked me to farm tears specifically for them, I would work out a price, and we'd be off to some great RP down the line. What they do with the tears I've sold is entirely up to them, but the ability to sell tears to someone else for a higher price would most certainly be an option. Buy low or steal, sell high. That's the basics for a criminal empire. It can be done with tears, if they're made more feasible in game. Right now, there's just not enough benefit to taking that effort in doing it.

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