Guestroom Teaching... Sucks? Rules? You tell us...

[Geist]

We are beginning a revision of the Teach/Learn code that incorporates suggestions made previously in many threads and polls. However, there is one controversial one I'd like to address - teaching/learning in private guestrooms. Not realistic, but we know that this is the circumstance that enables OOC training and alt-skill trading and other abuses.

It is not realistic to limit it, really, so that begs the question....

Guestroom teach/learn ban... Sucks! or Rules!

What do you think?

[TonyD]

Is it possible to instead stop teaching between alts.

If you want your one alt to teach the other (for legitimate reasons - like a 3rd person told your one alt to train the other) then you should get another player involved, teach them, and have them teach the alt.

Otherwise, players can teach each other in the guestrooms (even while idle, there may be a reason to bluebook the lesson?)

Unless you have some other method of stopping players from being idle. Otherwise I predict two idle players having a lesson in some stairwell nook instead of a guestroom, but otherwise doing the exact same thing anyway.

[Tsi]

What if the lecture hall is full, and a teacher wants to have a private lesson with his/her students? Best place for that...a guest room!

What if someone wants to give secret villanry lessons to Xthug. Best place to make sure nothing gets discovered? Guest room!

[Gabs]

I think it rules. Teaching in guestrooms, IMO, is an open invitation for OOC teaching/cheating, because there's no way you'll get caught.

And you know, if the lecture hall is full, for example, there are a lot of other more private locations your characters could move to for that Northern lesson, for example. How about the cupola? The little balconies north of the courtyard? The lobby near the bowling alley? The window seats on the 1st and 2nd floor?

Want to teach your super secret villain skills? Make it more exciting; go to the tunnels.

[Geist]

Originally posted by TonyD
Is it possible to instead stop teaching between alts.

If you want your one alt to teach the other (for legitimate reasons - like a 3rd person told your one alt to train the other) then you should get another player involved, teach them, and have them teach the alt.

Otherwise, players can teach each other in the guestrooms (even while idle, there may be a reason to bluebook the lesson?)

Unless you have some other method of stopping players from being idle. Otherwise I predict two idle players having a lesson in some stairwell nook instead of a guestroom, but otherwise doing the exact same thing anyway.

I believe alt-instruction is already prohibited in the code. If not, it will be soon. And we are addressing the idle issue as well. This poll/thread was specifically about guestroom issues. There have already been many other polls and discussions about teaching issues overall.

[Adayne]

Ya, you can't teach your alt.

As for teaching in rooms, actually. It depends. I enjoy taking students into rooms sometimes and teaching. It's far less distracting than being forced to teach out in public. And, logically the sudden restriction to teaching in a room would be odd. I can take a person into a room and sit down with them and go over languages with little problem.

I would lean more toward requiring props for some things.

Though, having a prop in your inventory just for teaching could become cumbersome. Maybe if a dye pot is in the vacinity you can teach dying, or needles, or specified language books etc.

[John]

Originally posted by Geist
We are beginning a revision of the Teach/Learn code that incorporates suggestions made previously in many threads and polls. However, there is one controversial one I'd like to address - teaching/learning in private guestrooms. Not realistic, but we know that this is the circumstance that enables OOC training and alt-skill trading and other abuses.

It is not realistic to limit it, really, so that begs the question....

Guestroom teach/learn ban... Sucks! or Rules!

What do you think?

Yes I know some people abuse it, but others dont. If i take a northern lesson from someone in my room, its becouse I want to be in my room IG. I may be showing them something, I may be entertaining (like with wine and the such.) we may be going over some treason scrolls written in northern, whatever it may be, its a good reason to not be out somewhere.

Also, realisticly, its stupid and silly. Suddenly you cant learn or teach becouse your in your room? I mean that would have to be magic, but the plot behind modifying everyones minds only while in rooms would be convoluted and obviously put in place to support an OOC rulling.
In short, leave the guestrooms alone on this.

[John]

Originally posted by Gabs
I think it rules. Teaching in guestrooms, IMO, is an open invitation for OOC teaching/cheating, because there's no way you'll get caught.

And you know, if the lecture hall is full, for example, there are a lot of other more private locations your characters could move to for that Northern lesson, for example. How about the cupola? The little balconies north of the courtyard? The lobby near the bowling alley? The window seats on the 1st and 2nd floor?

Want to teach your super secret villain skills? Make it more exciting; go to the tunnels.

What about Inner areas as well? As we know, most inner people are not supposed to go in and out of the outer all the time without reason. However I have seen people in the inner (Mostly VPs and the like) who get offended when they run into a lesson in the inner out in the open.

[Geist]

Originally posted by Adayne
I would lean more toward requiring props for some things.

In the plan.

[Gabs]

Originally posted by John
What about Inner areas as well? As we know, most inner people are not supposed to go in and out of the outer all the time without reason. However I have seen people in the inner (Mostly VPs and the like) who get offended when they run into a lesson in the inner out in the open.

There's always the reading room on the library's second floor, or the musician gallery. Or even other locations such as the Knight's Hall (for those that have access), or the Collegium tower. Those aren't ultra-public places.

[Xewe]

Or if you are in the Inner and looking for a sparring session you could always take it down to the Lower Courtyard that Ali hangs out when he's in the castle.

[Fez]

If you're doing that, then you should make it obvious someone is actively giving a lesson.

A lesson is IG a focused instruction and study. Make it clear. That way you don't have folk who are doing a lesson that was started in a hall, while sitting in the courtyard talking about the weather.

Personally, I don't like restricting it from rooms, as I can't figure out any IG justification at all.

Instead, I'd be intrigued if you could as part of asses, if equal to a person in skill, get who gave their last lesson, and if greater to in skill, get more information like who were the people who gave them their last skill gain or two. Ie.. you get a particular person's intonation and use of grammar, or style with a sword, or typical cross-stitch.

Then you could see who was really teaching whom.

[Geist]

Originally posted by Fez
Instead, I'd be intrigued if you could as part of asses, if equal to a person in skill, get who gave their last lesson, and if greater to in skill, get more information like who were the people who gave them their last skill gain or two. Ie.. you get a particular person's intonation and use of grammar, or style with a sword, or typical cross-stitch.

Then you could see who was really teaching whom.

Be careful what you wish for...

[Kitra]

Originally posted by Fez
Then you could see who was really teaching whom.

ooooo I like that idea

[Diedra]

I'm an extreme nazi when it comes to teaching and rp'ng it etc... but... Per the teaching in guest rooms -- I'm adamantly for that still being allowed. I can easily say that -tons- of my lessons have been done in guest rooms.

Whether its a private language lecture circle for several people, or sparring in private, either way, I enjoy small groups for rp and that is one way to be able to do that without having to be in an area where people can just walk in. My main, for instance, just started working on sword practices again when all this shadow stuff kicked up because she felt she had to. Even still, over the span of playing her, I'd estimate that about 85% of her sword lessons were done in a private room. Lot's of reasons for that. Sometimes it was because she was learning from a wanted criminal, but mostly its because she -hates- getting her ass kicked in front of people so she never likes to 'fumble through' and learn in front of people. For the same reason, and some particularly embarassing (scaring even!) experiences at lectures (*grins at Namida for being evil*) most of her personal language lessons have been done in private.

Aside from that, its just plain fun to hop over furniture and stuff, and with the way it is now (for example) where you can't spar anywhere but the practice hall, that -only- leaves the guest rooms as an alternative unless you feel like getting in trouble for having a simple spar.

On the requiring things/objects to learn... eh, I'm sorta half there with that. There are few circumstances that have been pointed out in different posts on this topic about how someone can easily rp (realistically) teaching some things without props. Not everything mind you, nor even a majority, but enough that it makes me hesitant to support requiring props for everything. Hopefully, they wouldn't be required for -everything,- in light of some of those old discussions.

Originally posted by Fez
Instead, I'd be intrigued if you could as part of asses, if equal to a person in skill, get who gave their last lesson, and if greater to in skill, get more information like who were the people who gave them their last skill gain or two. Ie.. you get a particular person's intonation and use of grammar, or style with a sword, or typical cross-stitch.

Then you could see who was really teaching whom.

On this, I'd like to take a moment to raise my hand and shout a very loud 'Hell, No.' So many potential problems and issues came to mind immediately that I don't even want to consider touching that and I certainly don't want to deal with that in game.

~Nicole